Harmony

krishna · Post by **krishna** » Tue Dec 24, 2013 5:32 pm

Hi All,
Long time lurker, first time poster

I was wondering if there is a way to get Kronos to play an additional note (harmony) for every key press. For example, I want Kronos to harmonize the notes in the first line with the ones from the second.

D E F# G A B C#
F# G A B C# D E

I'd imagine this might be something like a combi, but having the second patch in a combi simply transposed doesn't work.

Any help appreciated.

Thanks,
K

ferchis · Post by **ferchis** » Tue Dec 24, 2013 5:45 pm

the pads...?

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Dec 24, 2013 6:57 pm

Probably with Karma, but I suck at programming that.

jazlover · Post by **jazlover** » Tue Dec 24, 2013 8:11 pm

There are already programs that are programed to play the fifth up (or fourth down). If you have more than one oscillator couldn't just program one oscillator a major 3rd up? I believe you can without much programming skills.

ronnfigg · Post by **ronnfigg** » Wed Dec 25, 2013 3:29 am

jazlover wrote:There are already programs that are programed to play the fifth up (or fourth down). If you have more than one oscillator couldn't just program one oscillator a major 3rd up? I believe you can without much programming skills.

The line that the OP references is a mixture of major and minor 3rds. Tuning won't work. Karma might be a way to do it. Maybe Mr. Kay can help. Can't you just play the harmony?

krishna · Post by **krishna** » Wed Dec 25, 2013 9:58 am

ronnfigg wrote: The line that the OP references is a mixture of major and minor 3rds. Tuning won't work. Karma might be a way to do it. Maybe Mr. Kay can help. Can't you just play the harmony?

Thats right. I'm looking for more than just fixed interval harmony. @ronnfigg - I do play it most of the time but there are some really fast passages where I can't.

I was reading the manual earlier and "User Scales" caught my attention. I created a new user scale where I tuned a note either one semitone lower or higher to fit the harmony. I then created a combi with two tracks and set its scale to said user scale and transposed one of the tracks. The user scale helps "translate" the harmony line into a fixed interval even though it really isn't one. This works for me for the time being, but I'm still curious to learn how to use KARMA (which I have no experience with) to solve the same problem.

Thanks everybody.

HardSync · Post by **HardSync** » Wed Dec 25, 2013 12:55 pm

This can be definitely be done with KARMA using a custom Note Map Table although I'm not sure at the moment which GE to choose ... maybe the Pad Holder or RT Bend GE with the pitch bending turned off -- would have to investigate that. You need a GE that will hold the (harmonised) note for the duration you have they root note key pressed and follow exactly what you're playing without any delay.

In any case, once you find an appropriate GE, you can program the Note Map on the KARMA > Name/Note Map tab so that when you play a D the GE will instead play a F#, and when you play an E the GE plays a G and so on. Repeat this for each note you want to harmonise.

You need to turn on the Note Map for the GE on the KARMA > Control tab. Select "Custom" and the "On-All" settings for the module.

You should also turn on the Thru In Zone for the timbre/GE on the KARMA > GE Setup/Key Zones tab to get the harmony you want, in other words, you get both the D and F# sounding at the same time when only pressing the D key. The upside here is that you don't need to use two timbres, you can use one timbre and KARMA does the work for you.

You'll need to consider what to do with the additional notes outside of the scale. There's the "remove" option in the note map's "out" setting, which may be useful here.

For general info on KARMA Note Maps, check out:

http://karma-lab.wikidot.com/karma2:cha ... ated-by-ka

In the Kronos's Parameter guide, Note Maps are explained on pages 132 & 133, and also on pages 114 & 115.

I know this probably won't make any sense if you don't have a basic understanding of KARMA. Sorry...

By the way, I can understand that playing the harmony in the key of D might be a bit tricky for fast passages. What you could do is play it in the key of C and transpose the timbre by +2 so that it sounds in the key of D. It's a lot easier to play these harmonies on the white keys only... just a thought.

Myq · Post by **Myq** » Wed Dec 25, 2013 9:32 pm

Greetings .

Not sure if this is what you're looking for , but I think you could try the Chord Mode . I'm not in front of my Kronos right now , so if my memory serve me right , here it goes :

First of all , you'll need to turn on the Chord mode to Basic or Advance from [Basic/Vector] page > [Program Basic] tab under Voice Assign Mode section .

Then , from the same [Basic/Vector] page , under [Pads] tab , you can now assign those harmony notes or chords to any of the 8 pads . You can also set different velocities for each individual notes if you wish so .

Now , select the pad that you've assigned those chords on , and play the keyboard . You'll get those harmony / chord sound from a single note/key play , where that played single note represent the lowest note of the chord .

Optionally , you can also turn Chord Mode on / off by using switch 1/2 or the assignable foot switch , so that you could turn on / off your harmony on the fly .

Well , hope this helps . Thanks .

P/S : Merry Christmas & Happy New Year .

ferchis · Post by **ferchis** » Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:37 am

as MyQ is suggesting, my first go would be at the pads...

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Thu Dec 26, 2013 9:23 am

Both of those are fixed interval. Karma is the only thing capable of intelligently harmonizing.

bobmusic · Post by **bobmusic** » Thu Dec 26, 2013 10:28 am

SanderXpander wrote:Karma is the only thing capable of intelligently harmonizing.

That's interesting. Do you need Karma software or can it be done on Kronos alone?

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:39 pm

I don't think you need the software at all to do things like this.

I'm wondering if you can achieve this just with a GE that passes through notes, using the module transpose and the note remapper.

Depends if the transpose comes before or after the remap.

HardSync · Post by **HardSync** » Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:57 pm

X-Trade wrote:I don't think you need the software at all to do things like this.

I'm wondering if you can achieve this just with a GE that passes through notes, using the module transpose and the note remapper.

Depends if the transpose comes before or after the remap.

I tested it yesterday. It's achievable.

HardSync · Post by **HardSync** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:09 pm

OK, I'm not sure if the original poster ever got this to work or still wants to get it to work. But I did some further investigation into this. It turns out that the RT Harmony/Bend GE is a really good choice for doing this. It's a very cool GE in its own right. Anyway, by using this GE you don't need to turn on the Thru In Zone for the timbre, but you still need to use the note map.* If anyone is interested, I'll list out the steps.

*It might be possible to use Chord Scan analysis instead to automatically shift the notes in the right scale, that is if you're playing a chord elsewhere on the keyboard, but I haven't tested that... yet.

wan · Post by **wan** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:19 pm

Hi all,

I've investigated this a few years ago, you can do this with Karma. You can play chords with your left hand that doesn't produce sound, but controls karma modules that are active on the line you play with your right hand. It will produce harmonies based on the chord. It's a cool effect. See this thread for sound demoos and a link to demo combi's i made:

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... hp?t=68179