Do you need KARMA on next KORG WS?

[afr]

Do you think that KARKA is a key feature on KORG workstation or can be enough to have 4 or 8 standard and programmable arpeggiators?

[Johnny Puperze]

voted for no, as long as you won´t be able to utilize / customize all of it´s functions on the machine itself

but my real hope for the next generation is that korg will revise their workstation paradigm and add arranger keyboard capabilities to it, as i think the ability to transpose user created patterns on the fly is way more "professional" than "simple" arpeggiated stuff

having said that, i think i will stick with my m3 anyway, since i think it is a sick machine nevertheless - and i got a qy-70 again recently, which is an incredible little beast that more than satisfies my arranger needs

[Hugo]

I think Korg definately should continue with the KARMA technology, but programming user patterns on the machine itself is a must - even if it would only allow for limited programming. It should at least be possible to program to the extent a decent arpeggiator would allow.

[orpheus2006]

I'd love to see a new KARMA version where you
(a) can choose a note series by changing a KARMA parameter (as it is implemented in today's KARMA version)
(b) allows the user to define the note series and somehow assign it to the KARMA parameter.
Similar for the rhythm pattern and duration pattern.

So you have both, inspiration + fast predictable results.

[mocando]

On synth engines I think very little can be improved, or maybe it can, but I don't see it like actual engines are so bad that we desperately need new ones. I know you mean Karma, but let me make my point.

What I would like to see is more "virtual" synths, a-la-oasys. Why not a computer with a keybed and all legacy collection vsynths running inside ? It could be called a Legastation or something like that. Upgradable, having the option of adding more vsynths, or any VST you might like. Karma will be an option too. Want a sampler? Load a sampler VST. Want a Hammond emulation? Load up a B3 VST. It could be a DAW like interface, with a virtual rack of instruments controlling midi channel and keyzone for each.

Korg can make a VST standard for the Legastation, so all external buttons and knobs can be easily assigned to the controls of the VST. Or maybe touch the controller with the touchscreen, and change it with a thumbwheel or enter numbers with the keypad.
VST makers will be thrilled to code for Korg as they will sell lots of VSTs. Korg didn't buy Stephen Kay's Karma technology, simply included in some of their synths and pays him a royalty for that (I presume). Why not do the same with so many high quality VST makers, like Musiclab, for instance.

Maybe I'm not making sense, but I think that would be a real breakthrough. Of course, it has to be priced in the M50/M3 range.

I mean, all the software I'm naming runs on a 300 $ pc. Including Karma. Adding a touchscreen and a keybed can't be too costly. People have been doing this for years with a laptop and a MIDI controller. Why not putting all those things inside a keyboard case and sell it ?

Surprise us guys

[Synthoid]

Korg can make a VST standard for the Legastation, so all external buttons and knobs can be easily assigned to the controls of the VST. Or maybe touch the controller with the touchscreen, and change it with a thumbwheel or enter numbers with the keypad.
VST makers will be thrilled to code for Korg as they will sell lots of VSTs. Korg didn't buy Stephen Kay's Karma technology, simply included in some of their synths and pays him a royalty for that (I presume). Why not do the same with so many high quality VST makers, like Musiclab, for instance.

Maybe I'm not making sense, but I think that would be a real breakthrough. Of course, it has to be priced in the M50/M3 range.

Makes sense to me... let's see what happens at next years' winter NAMM show.

I voted YES for Karma. Can't do without it now... I also have a Motif XS with 4 programmable arps, but it's not the same-- too static.

[X-Trade]

Why not a computer with a keybed and all legacy collection vsynths running inside ? It could be called a Legacystation or something like that.
...
Karma will be an option too.

...

Load up a B3 VST. It could be a DAW like interface, with a virtual rack of instruments controlling midi channel and keyzone for each.

The same thing occurred to me this morning actually
I may do something similar for my project synth after i've finished university: unload my custom software, spend a bit of money, put on a decent host and the legacy collection + B4II. Shame I can't add 'KARMA' though. That would be the ultimate synth combination for me.

Also I'm not sure the GUI for any of those plugins will fit on my 800x480 touchscreen.


I definately agree with the basic concept though:
- Legacy collection synths as in the OASYS, but more seperated and legacy orientated
- Touch screen
- Keep the 'classic wedge' shape, make it like a cross between the polysix (wedge shape, wooden ends) and the Wavestation (black, metal, minimal - a few assignable controllers and a vector joystick). I guess a bit like a Kurz.
- add a 'combi' mode where we can combine programs from any of the 'plugin' synths, just like in a normal KORG Workstation combi mode
- add a sequencer for good measure.
- ADD KARMA

Ultimate synthesis station right there!

Then add an online shop and SDK where we can buy more synth engines from KORG and a select few developers (like iPhone App Store). There is a small discussion on this kind of system in the 'open labs' topic in the 'general keyboards' section here.



as for karma:
I think it is great, but could do with a bit more thinking out with regards to getting more control over rhythm, and making the modules tie in together. Importing user patterns straight into GEs would be a good start. I definitely want to see KARMA again in another Korg synth.

[Randelph]

Yeah, KARMA is great- gets my vote- SO much better than arps.

One thing I'd like more of though is more drum machine functionality (which was one of the key reasons I bought the board). I like many of the patterns and use them all the time. But unlike KARMA or even arps on other boards, the drum patterns are fixed, so there's no adjusting swing or any of the parameters that allow realtime variations. And being able to EASILY store existing drum patterns to User slots is a no brainer- why is this so difficult to do? There's no easy way to pick out the drum patterns that I like and have them be available as a group.

[Ultimate Dj]

Yes of course it needs it! otherwise I bet Korg will lose a lot of customers to OL. Heck thats what is making me consider one as I know that Karma will always be most updated on the OLs


puravida
Dj

[Synthoid]

Yes of course it needs it! otherwise I bet Korg will lose a lot of customers to OL.

Open Labs gear is so expensive. I doubt many people will be migrating in that direction.

[Ultimate Dj]

Yes of course it needs it! otherwise I bet Korg will lose a lot of customers to OL.

Open Labs gear is so expensive. I doubt many people will be migrating in that direction.

well yes but depending on the price of the next Korg Workstation ya know?


puravida
Dj

[BasariStudios]

DEFINETELY YES! NO QUESTIONS ASKED!

Be it onboard editing and manipulation or soft, doesn't matter.

[BasariStudios]

as i think the ability to transpose user created patterns on the fly is way more "professional" than "simple" arpeggiated stuff

Then you think wrong, you maybe missunderstood the Termins of KARMA and
ARRANGER where Arranger is nothing compared to a KARMA engine which you
call Simple Arpegiated...lolz...only if you know how KARMA works...

[gjvti]

Well, I'm not sure that I will ever buy a next Korg workstation since M3 for me is absolutely fine rompler/sampler-sound generator, but I'd very much love to see software/hardware upgrades for it even to purchase ones. It is absolutely ok for me to pay for next major m3 OS update if it involves updated karma version, which allowed basic pattern editing right on m3 (without pc), and/or adds user programmable arpeggios like on TR and/or some other interesting features like pattern sequencing/programming using hardware controls/keyboard, also multitrack RPPRs with dedicated piano roll editor (why korg didn't allow piano roll while editing rpprs right on OS2 ? ) are warmly welcome, as well as Korg sos style recording etc. BTW, I can't help wondering what is the reason that you can do layered USB/SD audio recording on sos, but you can't do that on Korgs current flagship synth workstation, moreover/even worse sos is not compatible/midi-synchronizable with m3 . However I understand that m3 is not built that flexible as simple software synth, so there obviously is not much room for low investment-huge impact style improvements Anyway if Korg makes something innovative and EASY to program/use I'm always open to consider despite that there are looots of interesting synths around - competition is very hard

[Johnny Puperze]

as i think the ability to transpose user created patterns on the fly is way more "professional" than "simple" arpeggiated stuff

Then you think wrong, you maybe missunderstood the Termins of KARMA and
ARRANGER where Arranger is nothing compared to a KARMA engine which you
call Simple Arpegiated...lolz...only if you know how KARMA works...

with "simple" arpeggiators i was adressing the workstation market in general and not the m3 or karma specifically, because it seems that many seem to think that arrangers are nice toys for cheesy weddings
and at least to my understanding their auto accompaniment functions are much more flexible than the standard arpeggiator you get with most workstations - and these simple arpeggios could be painted in easily in the prv anyway, but sadly neither karma nor the rppr function let me transpose exactly these patterns (or others i played in) as easily as an arranger does.

of course karma can do much more than that, but at least on the m3 you "only" have 4 karma modules and you can not program / record your own patterns on the unit itself.
plus quite a few of its features can also be done on the fly on "toys" from the mid 90´s like the yamaha qy700 though unlike karma, the destinations are mostly midi notes and not routable to many things- but you can do all the stuff on the unit itself and the functions are self explanatory and easy to access.

don´t get me wrong: i love korg and i love my m3, and of course compared to an arranger it is "superior" in other areas, but at least for my needs, a workstation with the comprehensive accompaniment functions (and ease of use to achieve this) of a good arranger kb would be the best thing ever.

and of course i would not mind if i had the ability to karmify the stuff later on