I have Cubase Studio 4 set as the master clock and on the 01W, Local Control is set to OFF and the clock source is set to External. This is what the ONE page in the 01W manual relating to external sources says to do. At this point, Cubase SHOULD play the sequence in the 01W, but it doesn't behave properly. It usually just locks the 01W up entirely!
When it does record, it scrambles the Programs badly. There is no evidence of a program change header or any such information. The NOTE information plays back; the MIDI Event List in Cubase shows NO PROGRAM CHANGES coming from the 01W, so the piece never sounds the way it should. This is absolutely screwing me, as I HAVE to manipulate the MIDI tracks with quantizing and the like or all of that work is lost.
How do you get the 01W to send out its own program changes within a sequence? I see note and pitchbend data, but no PROGRAM CHANGES. I've tried numerous variations, including starting the sequence from the Korg, but still, that vital data is never retained, or maybe ever sent at all. Neither Korg nor Steinberg seem to be able to help and it seems as though this flagship synth is missing a terribly important function. Help!
Why will the 01W not send out its program changes?
Moderators: Sharp, X-Trade, Pepperpotty, karmathanever
It's not clear from your post what you're trying to achieve. Are you trying to transfer sequences recorded in the synth's sequencer into Cubase? If so, you have things backwards. The O1W should be the master and Cubase the slave.
I've done this in the past successfully many times using Digital Performer. If I recall correctly, the O1W dumps its Program Change, volume, and panning info at the tail end of each track when you record into your software sequencer (but not any parameters from Page 2 of the sequencer, like Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range, etc). You could always try inserting the Program Change for each track at its head by using the Event Editor on the synth before doing the transfer.
If the transfer of sequences from hardware to software is not what you want to do, please explain further.
Kind regards.
I've done this in the past successfully many times using Digital Performer. If I recall correctly, the O1W dumps its Program Change, volume, and panning info at the tail end of each track when you record into your software sequencer (but not any parameters from Page 2 of the sequencer, like Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range, etc). You could always try inserting the Program Change for each track at its head by using the Event Editor on the synth before doing the transfer.
If the transfer of sequences from hardware to software is not what you want to do, please explain further.
Kind regards.
Dave Bourke
- ideation -
- ideation -
>>> [quote="dave"]It's not clear from your post what you're trying to achieve. Are you trying to transfer sequences recorded in the synth's sequencer into Cubase? If so, you have things backwards. The O1W should be the master and Cubase the slave.
Okay, I'll try it, but the 01W manual says the opposite. Exactly how do I get the 01W to start Record in Cubase, or any sequencer? How does hitting Play on the 01W tell Cubase to start recording? Do you put DP in a Record/Pause mode to manage that? Surely there has to be some sort of handshake so they will sync up.
>>>> I've done this in the past successfully many times using Digital Performer. If I recall correctly, the O1W dumps its Program Change, volume, and panning info at the tail end of each track when you record into your software sequencer (but not any parameters from Page 2 of the sequencer, like Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range, etc).
So you have to record the entire piece to get program changes to show up at the beginning? That is, it "saves up" program changes and then splices it all together when recording stops? If that would generate the right changes when I hit Play in Cubase, great.
>>>> You could always try inserting the Program Change for each track at its head by using the Event Editor on the synth before doing the transfer.
Exactly where do I look to find that function? The manual says nothing about this and I have been guessing fruitlessly for a month. That sounds like a real time-consuming kluge when it SHOULD recognize that data the same as any other sort. If it will control outboard hardware on different channels, the destinations being sequencer tracks should be no different, I'd think, or would LIKE to think.
>>> If the transfer of sequences from hardware to software is not what you want to do, please explain further.
That's exactly it. I need the MIDI data in the 01W to be recorded properly in Cubase so I can treat it further with quantizing and the like. I just can't get it to follow the program changes, hence, no way to mix down many hours of work.
Okay, I'll try it, but the 01W manual says the opposite. Exactly how do I get the 01W to start Record in Cubase, or any sequencer? How does hitting Play on the 01W tell Cubase to start recording? Do you put DP in a Record/Pause mode to manage that? Surely there has to be some sort of handshake so they will sync up.
>>>> I've done this in the past successfully many times using Digital Performer. If I recall correctly, the O1W dumps its Program Change, volume, and panning info at the tail end of each track when you record into your software sequencer (but not any parameters from Page 2 of the sequencer, like Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range, etc).
So you have to record the entire piece to get program changes to show up at the beginning? That is, it "saves up" program changes and then splices it all together when recording stops? If that would generate the right changes when I hit Play in Cubase, great.
>>>> You could always try inserting the Program Change for each track at its head by using the Event Editor on the synth before doing the transfer.
Exactly where do I look to find that function? The manual says nothing about this and I have been guessing fruitlessly for a month. That sounds like a real time-consuming kluge when it SHOULD recognize that data the same as any other sort. If it will control outboard hardware on different channels, the destinations being sequencer tracks should be no different, I'd think, or would LIKE to think.
>>> If the transfer of sequences from hardware to software is not what you want to do, please explain further.
That's exactly it. I need the MIDI data in the 01W to be recorded properly in Cubase so I can treat it further with quantizing and the like. I just can't get it to follow the program changes, hence, no way to mix down many hours of work.
OK, since I'm not at all familiar with Cubase, there's really no point in my describing how the process works with DP.
However, here's a way to achieve the same thing no matter what sequencer is involved:
Save each song as a Standard MIDI File to a floppy on the O1W. Import it into Cubase. Save.
Now, on the O1W, delete all the MIDI data from the song so that only the Track Settings are left. Then, in Cubase, add two or three blank measures at the start of the song (or shift everything later in time).
Go to Global on the synth and select "Dump Sequence." Hit Record in Cubase, then immediately initiate the dump on the synth. When the synth tells you it's finished transmitting, hit Stop in Cubase.
You've just recorded, via sysex, all the O1W's parameters for that song, including Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range – plus the Effects page setup. Go into the Event Editor in Cubase and move that new sysex event back to the very start of the sequence.
Now, each time you open the song in Cubase and play it, the sysex gets transmitted first and sets up the O1W sequencer exactly the way it should be for the song.
Kind regards.
However, here's a way to achieve the same thing no matter what sequencer is involved:
Save each song as a Standard MIDI File to a floppy on the O1W. Import it into Cubase. Save.
Now, on the O1W, delete all the MIDI data from the song so that only the Track Settings are left. Then, in Cubase, add two or three blank measures at the start of the song (or shift everything later in time).
Go to Global on the synth and select "Dump Sequence." Hit Record in Cubase, then immediately initiate the dump on the synth. When the synth tells you it's finished transmitting, hit Stop in Cubase.
You've just recorded, via sysex, all the O1W's parameters for that song, including Transpose, Detune, Pitch Bend Range – plus the Effects page setup. Go into the Event Editor in Cubase and move that new sysex event back to the very start of the sequence.
Now, each time you open the song in Cubase and play it, the sysex gets transmitted first and sets up the O1W sequencer exactly the way it should be for the song.
Kind regards.
Dave Bourke
- ideation -
- ideation -
Your info would be good for any sequencer, basically. I was beginning to think of a SMF as a path to try, so you just put a fine point on the process. It sounds a little convoluted, but what synth problem isn't, heh. I have a lot of material that needs minor massaging, so if this works, I'll consider it a small price to pay. I've really loved this synth for years. Even though its slowly being phased out, I want to cap its run with good mixdowns of the things it inspired me to do.
I appreciate your suggestion. I'll give it a go and if it works, I'll make sure and share it anywhere there are 01W users.
I appreciate your suggestion. I'll give it a go and if it works, I'll make sure and share it anywhere there are 01W users.
[quote="HPH24"]Your info would be good for any sequencer, basically. I was beginning to think of a SMF as a path to try, so you just put a fine point on the process. It sounds a little convoluted, but what synth problem isn't, heh.
Well, I tried saving the file as a SMF on the main floppy I was using. It says "ERROR: Wrong Disk Type." Well, its a 720 kb DD2 disk with WORKING 01W sequences on it, so that's hard to fathom. I formatted a fresh disk and tried again. Same damned message. I can't even TRY the rest of your ideas because of this and the manual says squat past the error message itself. There does not seem to be a format 0 or 1 selection anywhere, either, so if that's the type its grousing about, how do I FIX that? I look forward to taking a "next step" that doesn't lead to another brick wall. Shouldn't the thing default to Type 0? What am I missing or what are they not TELLING me in the synth?
Well, I tried saving the file as a SMF on the main floppy I was using. It says "ERROR: Wrong Disk Type." Well, its a 720 kb DD2 disk with WORKING 01W sequences on it, so that's hard to fathom. I formatted a fresh disk and tried again. Same damned message. I can't even TRY the rest of your ideas because of this and the manual says squat past the error message itself. There does not seem to be a format 0 or 1 selection anywhere, either, so if that's the type its grousing about, how do I FIX that? I look forward to taking a "next step" that doesn't lead to another brick wall. Shouldn't the thing default to Type 0? What am I missing or what are they not TELLING me in the synth?
Hmm, I've never used 720 KB DD2 floppies on my O1/Wfd. I've always used the standard 1.4s, formatted on the synth, and they work just fine. I think DOS format works too – I regularly format PC floppies on my Mac for use with the Triton-Rack and the Karma. I'll try one of them in the O1/W tomorrow night to see if it works but I'm almost certain it should.
Kind regards.
Kind regards.
Dave Bourke
- ideation -
- ideation -
Well, I went and bought some 1.44 mb diskettes as the Korg help desk said to do (because I had the drive replaced and it is ALLEGEDLY the Panasonic drive that would read 1.44s) and the damned synth will not format THOSE EITHER, taped over at the bottom notch or not. It STILL says "Disk Type Error." DAMNIT. I cannot save ANYTHING as a SMF on either type of floppy. Several years of work are trapped on these things! I cannot send the files to Cubase as it stands, because it garbles the programs in the sequence's Combi or the 01W crashes, a first for me. I MUST find the format that will lead to a handshake! I can't mixdown without separate MIDI tracks, PERIOD.
The Korg guy says there IS no one higher in the company that I can get to and ask as a customer. This deeply pisses me off. I paid plenty for this synth and I at least deserve a working answer for why it will not function properly. SOMEone knows how to make this work. The functions are THERE, so I want them to FUNCTION. I am beginning to feel as if Korg is putting me off because its an old synth. No one really wants to dig into a 10+-year-old synth's paperwork, but tough, they should not have built it so well, argh:P.
Everything else still works, but not this one vital thing, upon which all of the rest resides. It should not be this hard nor asking that much for it to be resolved.
Does anyone have a further idea before I begin a soft jihad to make Korg tell me how to fix this? Its totally reasonable to ask the synth to do this and I am tried of fighting it. Its been 6 weeks of fruitless attempts to satisfy this rig. They're not going to like me when I am angry, heh heh....
The Korg guy says there IS no one higher in the company that I can get to and ask as a customer. This deeply pisses me off. I paid plenty for this synth and I at least deserve a working answer for why it will not function properly. SOMEone knows how to make this work. The functions are THERE, so I want them to FUNCTION. I am beginning to feel as if Korg is putting me off because its an old synth. No one really wants to dig into a 10+-year-old synth's paperwork, but tough, they should not have built it so well, argh:P.
Everything else still works, but not this one vital thing, upon which all of the rest resides. It should not be this hard nor asking that much for it to be resolved.
Does anyone have a further idea before I begin a soft jihad to make Korg tell me how to fix this? Its totally reasonable to ask the synth to do this and I am tried of fighting it. Its been 6 weeks of fruitless attempts to satisfy this rig. They're not going to like me when I am angry, heh heh....
After re-reading all this...
I am still puzzled...and wonder if the replacement drive may possibly be a prob....I can say I have Anvil, and two over the counter midi recorders on my comp...the O1W midi is plugged and on all the time...If I bring up Anvil Studio, it starts transfer, playing..or recording ...Whatever it was left in...and It HAS worked for most things I have sent to the comp...BUTTTTT I don't know if it means anything as I DON'T use any programs that way...so I HAVE NOT tried to transfer complete files...
John (ellll)
I am still puzzled...and wonder if the replacement drive may possibly be a prob....I can say I have Anvil, and two over the counter midi recorders on my comp...the O1W midi is plugged and on all the time...If I bring up Anvil Studio, it starts transfer, playing..or recording ...Whatever it was left in...and It HAS worked for most things I have sent to the comp...BUTTTTT I don't know if it means anything as I DON'T use any programs that way...so I HAVE NOT tried to transfer complete files...
John (ellll)
Naturally, Anvil Studio is for Windows, heh. I use an Intel Mac, another slowly dissipating liability:P. However, I'll give a few places a look, like Hit Squad and see if there is a sys-ex utility for that yet. I still think the issue lies in the 01 somewhere, back in the dusty sub-menus. Its just not logical to think it can't send sequencer data out as a packet when it WILL control outboard hardware from those same tracks. Hope springs eternal for proper data transmission. 
Hi Hellpope..!!!
If it won't be too cluttering...comeback at me sometime on why I NOW feel like I am hearing more "Graininess", or less than the normally wonderful O1Wfd pianos..(All I have ever found to match them is the new TR...)
I have changed the decay to match my grand piano downstairs (which took only a little change anyway...)..Is it just that I have been using them so much and am "hearing" what I didn't hear in my OWN? ...Mind(?) ! Just a note of what you think about it..(It COULD be I have tired my ears that bad...'cause I notice it when I have played a LOT in a day...)
My Regards !!! John
If it won't be too cluttering...comeback at me sometime on why I NOW feel like I am hearing more "Graininess", or less than the normally wonderful O1Wfd pianos..(All I have ever found to match them is the new TR...)
I have changed the decay to match my grand piano downstairs (which took only a little change anyway...)..Is it just that I have been using them so much and am "hearing" what I didn't hear in my OWN? ...Mind(?) ! Just a note of what you think about it..(It COULD be I have tired my ears that bad...'cause I notice it when I have played a LOT in a day...)
My Regards !!! John
Are you sure that Cubase isn't simply interpretting the Program Change messages from the synth (changing the info in the Inspector for the track) rather than recording them ?
Have you tried using a MIDI monitor like MIDI-OX or Snoize MidiMonitor to verify the synth is really sending the Program Change and Bank Change messages ?
Have you tried using a MIDI monitor like MIDI-OX or Snoize MidiMonitor to verify the synth is really sending the Program Change and Bank Change messages ?
[quote="ellll"]Hi Hellpope..!!!
>>> If it won't be too cluttering...comeback at me sometime on why I NOW feel like I am hearing more "Graininess", or less than the normally wonderful O1Wfd pianos..(All I have ever found to match them is the new TR...)
Its a matter of sampling rate. I finally got a bright, soloing rock-piano out of the 01W, bit it took a dab of intuition and a bit of the exciter effect. Its very full and useful, but it lacks subtle top end. The 01W was sampled at something like 32-35khz; the TR is sampled at 44 khz. That makes a huge difference on the other end.
Also, pianos don't generally stack well. You sometimes get minor phase differences that muddy things. I have a couple of sampled pianos now and don't need to labor over that as I once did, but my main 01W piano sounds a lot more present with a small dose of the TR on top. Less is more, but 3 db of a brighter piano at the attack can make for a much juicier composite.
>>> If it won't be too cluttering...comeback at me sometime on why I NOW feel like I am hearing more "Graininess", or less than the normally wonderful O1Wfd pianos..(All I have ever found to match them is the new TR...)
Its a matter of sampling rate. I finally got a bright, soloing rock-piano out of the 01W, bit it took a dab of intuition and a bit of the exciter effect. Its very full and useful, but it lacks subtle top end. The 01W was sampled at something like 32-35khz; the TR is sampled at 44 khz. That makes a huge difference on the other end.
Also, pianos don't generally stack well. You sometimes get minor phase differences that muddy things. I have a couple of sampled pianos now and don't need to labor over that as I once did, but my main 01W piano sounds a lot more present with a small dose of the TR on top. Less is more, but 3 db of a brighter piano at the attack can make for a much juicier composite.
[quote="Daz"]Are you sure that Cubase isn't simply interpretting the Program Change messages from the synth (changing the info in the Inspector for the track) rather than recording them ?
Have you tried using a MIDI monitor like MIDI-OX or Snoize MidiMonitor to verify the synth is really sending the Program Change and Bank Change messages ?[/quote]
Good point, but when I look at Cubase's MIDI List Editor, there are NO program changes in it. Notes and pitchbends make it; program changes, no. I'm going to grudgingly look ino MIDI Monitor, but if the Korg is not SENDING them, Cubase is hog-tied. Its making me angry, because the 01W has a specific place in the Global section for enabling/disabling program changes! It really should be almost automatic; its performance data, period. I'm still struggling to see the logic of it. If Cubase's MIDI list shows no program changes and its own MIDI filters are NOT set to stop any data at all, then doesn't it put it back in the 01W's court to send ALL sequence data out? That's the endless knot of it and so far, Korg has many What-Ifs and no solutions. I do not mind troubleshooting up to a point, but after a while the trouble starts shooting at ME and I'm just the cathouse pianist, not Black Bart, robbing banks and raping cattle along the way.
If Cubase is wide open, the 01W should be sending everything down the line. I'm still baffled at this peculiar lack.
Have you tried using a MIDI monitor like MIDI-OX or Snoize MidiMonitor to verify the synth is really sending the Program Change and Bank Change messages ?[/quote]
Good point, but when I look at Cubase's MIDI List Editor, there are NO program changes in it. Notes and pitchbends make it; program changes, no. I'm going to grudgingly look ino MIDI Monitor, but if the Korg is not SENDING them, Cubase is hog-tied. Its making me angry, because the 01W has a specific place in the Global section for enabling/disabling program changes! It really should be almost automatic; its performance data, period. I'm still struggling to see the logic of it. If Cubase's MIDI list shows no program changes and its own MIDI filters are NOT set to stop any data at all, then doesn't it put it back in the 01W's court to send ALL sequence data out? That's the endless knot of it and so far, Korg has many What-Ifs and no solutions. I do not mind troubleshooting up to a point, but after a while the trouble starts shooting at ME and I'm just the cathouse pianist, not Black Bart, robbing banks and raping cattle along the way.
If Cubase is wide open, the 01W should be sending everything down the line. I'm still baffled at this peculiar lack.
You know,
I need to remember that about stacking...You have spoken of it before...BUT when used carefully...AND the exciter...or some of the "after" effects avail. on comp,...It is still a hard piano to beat for average use....
In fact..I am so taken..(as a pianist), with the O1W...AND, TR pianos...I am buying a TR soon...I Must...(as I can't buy the Oasys...) I just must "be" piano as it is who I have been since age 6...
I spent several days looking at keyboards...and liked the sound of the TR the best...The grand is great downstairs...but it is hard to compose and record on an acoustic...however fine it is...so I NEED the keyboards...just to be happy..
My Regards, John
I need to remember that about stacking...You have spoken of it before...BUT when used carefully...AND the exciter...or some of the "after" effects avail. on comp,...It is still a hard piano to beat for average use....
In fact..I am so taken..(as a pianist), with the O1W...AND, TR pianos...I am buying a TR soon...I Must...(as I can't buy the Oasys...) I just must "be" piano as it is who I have been since age 6...
I spent several days looking at keyboards...and liked the sound of the TR the best...The grand is great downstairs...but it is hard to compose and record on an acoustic...however fine it is...so I NEED the keyboards...just to be happy..
My Regards, John