Build quality issue ??? fault ???

Discussion relating to the Korg Kronos Workstation.

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Rosen Sound
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Post by Rosen Sound »

sparkie wrote:
aron wrote:Did you miss my post? See you in the Roland Clan forum. Please stop bothering us and please read this. Hope it doesn't happen to your Jupiter.

http://forums.rolandclan.com/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38290
So 1 "ONE" person crashed their keyboard somehow and had to reload?? Whoopee. The data knob fell off my Kronos when I opened the box like many others. Now its reported the bar under the keybed isnt attached. SSD Problems, Noisy fans with smoke, Bank loading problems, Screen sucks and cant read it, XY knob is a $.89 part, sequencer is impossible, Not enough memory so you must swap, setlist bugs, on and on... and GM SUCKS and sounds like s**t!! OK Case closed!
every keyboard

EVERY SINGLE KEYBOARD

EVER

has numerous defective models coming off the line.

Jupiter 80 will be the same. Most people who buy high end korgs know what theyre getting and generally will be on this forum. It is the opposite for roland. they are more popular with preset junkies who love the roland name from back when. You wont hear about the horrow stories as much. especially on roland clan which is full of children.
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Current gear: Korg Kronos 61, Oberheim OB-8, Alesis Vortex
Past Gear: Triton Extreme w/moss & ram, Korg Radias, Kurzweil Micropiano, Triton classic, & Karma
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Post by sparkie »

robbinhood wrote:
sparkie wrote:
aron wrote:Did you miss my post? See you in the Roland Clan forum. Please stop bothering us and please read this. Hope it doesn't happen to your Jupiter.

http://forums.rolandclan.com/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38290
So 1 "ONE" person crashed their keyboard somehow and had to reload?? Whoopee. The data knob fell off my Kronos when I opened the box like many others. Now its reported the bar under the keybed isnt attached. SSD Problems, Noisy fans with smoke, Bank loading problems, Screen sucks and cant read it, XY knob is a $.89 part, sequencer is impossible, Not enough memory so you must swap, setlist bugs, on and on... and GM SUCKS and sounds like s**t!! OK Case closed!
every keyboard

EVERY SINGLE KEYBOARD

EVER

has numerous defective models coming off the line.

Jupiter 80 will be the same. Most people who buy high end korgs know what theyre getting and generally will be on this forum. It is the opposite for roland. they are more popular with preset junkies who love the roland name from back when. You wont hear about the horrow stories as much. especially on roland clan which is full of children.
Yeah I agree, we should watch out for those children with all those Roland keyboards that dont tell us their horrow stories.
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Rosen Sound
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Post by Rosen Sound »

sparkie wrote:
robbinhood wrote:
sparkie wrote: So 1 "ONE" person crashed their keyboard somehow and had to reload?? Whoopee. The data knob fell off my Kronos when I opened the box like many others. Now its reported the bar under the keybed isnt attached. SSD Problems, Noisy fans with smoke, Bank loading problems, Screen sucks and cant read it, XY knob is a $.89 part, sequencer is impossible, Not enough memory so you must swap, setlist bugs, on and on... and GM SUCKS and sounds like s**t!! OK Case closed!
every keyboard

EVERY SINGLE KEYBOARD

EVER

has numerous defective models coming off the line.

Jupiter 80 will be the same. Most people who buy high end korgs know what theyre getting and generally will be on this forum. It is the opposite for roland. they are more popular with preset junkies who love the roland name from back when. You wont hear about the horrow stories as much. especially on roland clan which is full of children.
Yeah I agree, we should watch out for those children with all those Roland keyboards that dont tell us their horrow stories.
]

Horror* smart ass...

Anyway... I think im gonna go ahead and tally up just how many more roland/ediroll products i get in for repair then a korg or yamaha...

It may be lower then i think, because usually i ask people "is this board worth the price of fixing?" ... they always say there roland lasted for about 2 years before it crapped out... hmm...
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Current gear: Korg Kronos 61, Oberheim OB-8, Alesis Vortex
Past Gear: Triton Extreme w/moss & ram, Korg Radias, Kurzweil Micropiano, Triton classic, & Karma
Come visit my Burbank California repair shop/recording studio! Rosensound.com
And my band: Sirion.us.com
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Post by aron »

> OK Case closed!

OK Goodbye and BTW I said I hope it doesn't happen to yours. I meant it. You are the one that read it the wrong way.

I noticed you haven't posted yet in Rolandclan. Come on!
Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.
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Post by Bruce Lychee »

robbinhood wrote:
every keyboard

EVERY SINGLE KEYBOARD

EVER

has numerous defective models coming off the line.

Jupiter 80 will be the same. Most people who buy high end korgs know what theyre getting and generally will be on this forum. It is the opposite for roland. they are more popular with preset junkies who love the roland name from back when. You wont hear about the horrow stories as much. especially on roland clan which is full of children.
I have one of the first batch Kronos sold in the US and the Jupiter 80. Design preferences notwithstanding, there is a stark difference in materials and build quality between the 2 products, with the Jupiter reflecting the use of high grade materials and a tightly run production line. I have had no issues at all with the Jupiter. Fit and finish is immaculate.

That being said, I think the discussions revolving around the build quality of the Kronos and comparisons with the Jupiter have gotten way out of hand on all fronts.

The substance of the Kronos outweighs any of the build quality concerns. The dial has been addressed and as ridiculous as the spacers might be, they are more of an annoyance. Just use some care during transport. The RH3 is completely playable and responsive, but I think justifying inconsistencies in height from key to key would be a disservice to potential Kronos owners. There just isn't any excuse for that and hopefully Korg addresses it on my Kronos. If they don't I will sell my Kronos, but thus far they have been fair and helpful in helping me resolve the issue.

The bashing of the respective sonic potential of the Kronos and Jupiter is getting even more ridiculous to me. They each have their strengths and weaknesses. I think my opinion of the Kronos' weaknesses have been reflected in subsequent professional reviews as well. I have also voiced my opinion on Roland's inability to nail EPs, which is really important to me. I appreciate the depth and variety of the Kronos synth engines and keyboard engines. I love the Roland pianos and think they are making huge strides in modeling that give their acoustic emulations incredible expressive qualities. Their VAs are also unique in sound and a great compliment to the Kronos engines.

I think as an owner of both products, I am in a position to give a somewhat objective comparison of both products. People may not agree with my assessments, but I definitely know that there is way too much misinformation and mudslinging going on now.

I may have been responsible for starting some of these discussions, but I'm not on board for this mess.
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runningman67
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we are so lucky

Post by runningman67 »

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Last edited by runningman67 on Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by SanderXpander »

I tried the Kronos 61 today for a few hours after first trying the 88 at a previous occasion. It was sitting next to a JP80 so I got a good sense to compare. I didn't think the Kronos, apart from the data wheel which was indeed quite flimsy on this model, had bad or even mediocre build quality. It felt strong and of high quality. That said, the JP80 next to it was built like a tank. I got the sense that it could fall down two floors of stairs and keep going. This is not to diss the Kronos, because again, I think it feels quite good. It was just that the JP looked remarkably tough. Even if the styling is weird :-P

I played the JP for a while and the sound was very nice, very "big".
To be honest I'm not really in the market for one because of certain limitations (for me mainly the lack of sampling and the file system from the 1980s). Mainly, it drove me crazy that there were so few buttons and sliders for live use. I love touchscreens as an aid to and intuitive way of editing but honestly, for actual use DURING PLAYING they suck and can never replace a real button or slider. The physical drawbar function on the Kronos is awesome. The switches to switch the buttons from levels to sound control to karma etc. are awesome. I feel that I would miss that a lot on the JP.

That said, I can see why people say that they are wonderful additions to each other. I'm just not sure I could do without sampling in my top tier live board, or I might get one eventually.
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KRONOS V JP80

Post by DavyP »

SANDER...

I would agree with your comments.

I also had a quick look at the JP80 alongside the Kronos 61 in my local music store and thought the same, although I did not listen to the sounds due to time constraints.

Both are solidly built (except the obvious Kronos plastic, flimsy, data wheel) but the JP80 wheel felt much more solid. Overall the JP80 does feel chunkier and more solid but to be fair it does not have anywhere near the amount of sliders, buttons, knobs, switches etc... as the Kronos which naturally would make the K more prone to damage etc..

Personally I do not like the styling of the JP80. A nod to the Jupiters of old but no where near as nice! Nowhere near as much instant "hands-on" control! And those buttons under the keyboard???

If I could afford it I would consider having both but maybe later??

It feels like Roland have gone more for a live performance/players board with restricted multitimbrality, no sampling, no audio recording, no sequencer.

If you're after a workstation its gotta be the Kronos for all round versatility and capability. If you need a live performance instrument it would be worth having a look at the JP80.
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Re: we are so lucky

Post by master logic »

runningman67 wrote: My wifes got a big nose, but she still hits all the right notes for me :D
Is that HONK minor? :wink:
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Post by aron »

I think we had a very nice discussion about the Jupiter here.

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... sc&start=0

However after getting my JP-8000, I think the Jupiter lost quite a bit of unique features that the JP had. Motion control is amazing! And those knobs and sliders!

I really like the Kronos 61 keyed. I think it is one of the best right now. I appreciate at the keyboard is not too heavy.
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Post by jimknopf »

Nice choice. 8kg.
Not the fastest filters, but as analag sounding as VA can get.

http://www.synthesizer.at/audio/rolandj ... rkshop.mp3
(don't mind the German comment at the beginning)
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Post by aron »

Thanks Jim what a demo! I love this JP!

One thing I do think the Kronos should have come with is a micro fiber KORG cloth!

Another consideration might be lower profile, fat knobs.

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Post by phattbuzz »

aron wrote:One thing I do think the Kronos should have come with is a micro fiber KORG cloth!
Darn - that might be a deal breaker for me! :wink:
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Re: we are so lucky

Post by EXer »

runningman67 wrote:My wifes got a big nose, but she still hits all the right notes for me :D
Do you mean she can play the keyboard with her nose? Image
PinkFloydDudi

Post by PinkFloydDudi »

Chriskk wrote:PinkFloydDudi wrote:
Then you are complaining about the sounds on the kronos? I've seen you champion the sounds on the JP80...from the videos I posted earlier, sorry man, that JP80 is laughable.
Sound quality is subjective. So, you can laugh at the JP-80's sounds. By the same token, another person can complain about the Kronos' sounds.

But when you claim that you own a Triton manufactured 20 years ago, you lose credibility.
I've had it for 5...i thought the other guy had it for 15...guess not.

Sound quality may be subjective to you...the thought that opinions can't be wrong is a horrible problem with society these days.

The only thing I can say is that if you think the sounds on the JP80 are anything other than laughable in those videos, to me that only says something about your ability to discern good tones from bad.

Bruce Lychee wrote:PinkFloydDudi

Let me make it clearer. Playing live and teaching piano are a fraction of what I do. I only play live because a few vocalists like to work with me. I only teach once every other week.

My needs for the Kronos are in the studio. A valid use for a workstation, no? I really haven't been complaining much as you have been bringing up the fact that I was complaining. I have stated pretty early on that I thought some of the Kronos sounds seem a bit dated. Unsurprisingly, professional reviews seem to echo that sentiment.
Really? Cause I have a boatload of professional opinions that say the Kronos sounds amazing. I'll link my sources after you link yours. Mine are from actual professional keyboard players...I'm going to guess yours are from people like you, who barely use it or don't even own it, sitting and complaining about it?
Go ahead, link me an article from some author who isn't even a keyboard player...I'd love to see it.
The kids I work with are very responsible. I only call them kids because I am 41. Nevertheless, having to remind them to put spacers isn't exactly something I have had to do before.
I don't use any spacers and have transported my Kronos probably more times than you've played yours already. Still no problems.
It is more laughable that you judge the Jupiter on YouTube videos. I own both the Kronos and Jupiter. So does RonF. I think both of us have attested to the quality of the Jupiter sounds. Both boards have their strengths and I certainly think in some areas the Jupiter sounds are much better. The same can be said for the Kronos.
I guess I have to be more blunt.

I don't care how many people agree with you...I'm calling out your credibility in regards to knowing what you are talking about. (and if RonF wants to be included, so be it).

Lets put it this way, I'll take the comments from a true professional keyboard player (Jordan Rudess) who USES the Kronos on stage and is arguably one of the best keyboard players alive right now...and who also has access to any keyboard he wants....over some random guy who teaches a kid a lesson every other week.

Your comments on durability and build quality are laughable given yours sits in a studio while others here (myself included) transport ours and use ours in different cities regularly....well again, that goes back to the whole credibility thing.
It is seemingly assumed here that everyone knows what they are talking about on an equal level. I challenge that thought process.

Someone already posted the video of a Roland JP80 having to be completely reinstalled. I'll take a cheap data wheel (which mind you, mine has never come off), over a re-initialization ALLLL day long.

Just curious - since you have nothing bad to say about the JP80 here...I'm wondering if you are also on the Roland forums trashing the JP80 and saying how great the Kronos is there?
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