Combine two different sets to one set?

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 12:46 am

KINKOS,
Call and put in an official complaint to where you bought it from...have them be sure to forward it to your Country's Korg distribtor.

That is important to do.

Karen, Last I heard Korg has said they do not have a plan to fx it, no resourse allocated...but that's been a while ago and maybe now that OS2 is out they may be working on it?

It would be good to get an update from Korg on this.

Jerry...if your listening...please will you get us an update.
Thanks,
Lee

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:52 am

KINKOS wrote:Hi everybody. I just purchased a PA800 few days ago, and ever since been trying to figure this combining sets out. When i searched the topic, I was surprised to see how often it had been asked already. I am disappointed very much because for my gigs i would need to do lots of combining. Lots of time is going to be wasted over a process that could've been spent making music. It definitely sounds like a library manger that you guys are talking about. I'm off to a bad start already. I feel like i was so exited for nothing. Looks like this keyboard is more designed for people who are happy with factory sounds/styles.

Hi Kinkos,

You make a very good point. It seems to me that Korg started out to sell the Pa800 and Pa2x as high end professional keyboards for top musicians, and then they stopped part way through before producing the interface software or file specifications for managing all the user files that professional musicians need. They were diverted to producing other products such as the Pa500 and Pa588 models and the DNC and score stuff in OS2, and never continued the work to improve the file management for the Pa800 and Pa2x.

There is still a lot of potential for the Pa800 and Pa2x user file management problems to be solved so that we will all recommend these keyboards as being suitable for pro use. But at the moment as you say they are more like very expensive home arrangers with huge user sound and sample expansion potential that most users cannot put to use.

Hopefully MickB will fix it with the evolution of PRM and XRM!!

Best regards,
Rob

abo59 · Post by **abo59** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 9:30 am

Many years ago, when I was employed by IBM, we had a company motto "The Customer is our V.I.P.".

No company can survive, much less grow and flourish, without satisfied customers. This is something that Korg has to realize and embrace.

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:55 pm

abo59,
Intersting...I worked for IBM for 30 years...yes, our BELIEF was 100% customer satisfaction...and we did our best to do exactly that.

I worked on hardware, operating systems, and applicaions as well as marketing.

I don't think it s feasable anymore, cost wise to have 100% sat. But a company needs to get as close as practical. Korg does pertty well, but could do beter.

Lee

yero · Post by **yero** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:27 am

This is how large companies work. If one guy complains they don't care . Does korg people read these forums? We need to figure out
who we can complain to get this rolling. So far we have about ten people and I am sure more exist. We need a game plan.

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:56 am

yero wrote:This is how large companies work. If one guy complains they don't care . Does korg people read these forums? We need to figure out who we can complain to get this rolling. So far we have about ten people and I am sure more exist. We need a game plan.

For "game plan" please search for the relevant threads on this forum that we have been writing over the last 18 months. We have also written in private to our contacts inside Korg. Despite all of our requests and a huge amount of pressure from users all over the world, the only response has been in private saying "this is not a priority for Korg at the present time".

The most promising result we have achieved so far, is that a very skilled developer called Mick Barry (MickB) is a long way down the road of developing software and decoding the file formats to fix the problems. The software is called XRM and PRM. And you can read all about Mick's "game plan" and download the current versions here:

http://www.palibrarian.net/

MickB, myself, Musician200, and Worth (all users of the forum and independent of Korg) are friends and co-producers of the "Korg Arranger Secrets" DVD's. This was a "project" we kicked off via this forum.

The reason I mention about that, is to explain that great things can be accomplished if (as independent users) we stop bitching and moaning about things like this, and instead we get things organised by ourselves using the huge amount of skill represented on this forum. If we add up the number of users and the skills we have, we potentially outnumber and outclass Korg many times over. We just need the co-operation and organisational ability and volunteers - at present in short supply.

You know, if we really put our minds to it, we could develop an independent "open OS" for the Korg Pa800 and Pa2x, in just the same way that independent "open OS" software has been developed for many appliances. If every Pa800 and Pa2x owner contributed $100 towards the project then it could be done. Then everything would be published and out in the open, and there would never be any problems about file compatibility and data exchange.

I do not trust any manufacturer to look after the interests of users when it comes to data compatibility and file exchange. They all want to control us and make things obsolete before their time, so we will keep paying and paying.

Best regards,
Rob

macboy · Post by **macboy** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:58 pm

KINKOS wrote:I feel like i was so exited for nothing. Looks like this keyboard is more designed for people who are happy with factory sounds/styles.

With all due respect, but combining different SET's is a possibility: it is difficult first time, but not impossible. It will take you maybe a half an hour to do it.

But after you make one perfect SET as you like, you will have it packed with more than 1000 styles ! If that is not enough?

I combined all the SET's I wanted and made ONE perfect SET. I never have to switch again to another SET, so it is a non-existing problem for me.

The only dream one could have, is that SET's with (multi)samples could be loaded in a fraction of a second.

Rather than that, once you make a perfect SET you should be able to play it with 1000 styles for a full year without hearing the same sound twice

Arash · Post by **Arash** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 3:25 pm

How about doing it the same way the "Korg Arranger Secrets" DVDs were done. The interested individuals could pay to obtain an access code to download the program.

Where do I send the money??

Arash

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:06 pm

Rob,
I really like what you have said and agree completely. We do have tons of talent here!

I think the real future IS open systems. There are a few company's currently doing there own arranger using PC technology and some special HW also. Don't think it is actually open, but it is a departation from the usual approach.

I wander is there enough documentation of the Korg Pa to allow us to write Open OS?

Lee

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 6:31 pm

Hi Lee,

Yes, it was a bit of a crazy suggestion about an Open OS. There are one or two custom ASIC's and it would be necessary to reverse engineer how they are used. Not impossible, but very difficult. It would be cheaper to offer Korg $ several million for their source code and then take it into the public domain for onward development.

Best regards,
Rob

KINKOS · Post by **KINKOS** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:58 pm

macboy wrote:
KINKOS wrote:I feel like i was so exited for nothing. Looks like this keyboard is more designed for people who are happy with factory sounds/styles.
With all due respect, but combining different SET's is a possibility: it is difficult first time, but not impossible. It will take you maybe a half an hour to do it.

But after you make one perfect SET as you like, you will have it packed with more than 1000 styles ! If that is not enough?

I combined all the SET's I wanted and made ONE perfect SET. I never have to switch again to another SET, so it is a non-existing problem for me.

The only dream one could have, is that SET's with (multi)samples could be loaded in a fraction of a second.

Rather than that, once you make a perfect SET you should be able to play it with 1000 styles for a full year without hearing the same sound twice

Macboy,
Please think of yourself as one single user and not more! how you handle your music , gigs,user styles..etc does not represent anybody else. This is a "BIG PROBLEM" for a lot of users obviously, because i signed up in few forums within the last few days, and i've seen this topic all over the place. It's definitley more than "half hour" process, for people who need to do this constantly for several reasons. I'm glad that you have a perfect set for your gigs, but that means nothing to me and many others. If a company dares to call a product professional arranger, it must have a professional approach towards solving a problem that it existed for a long time. It's very nice to hear about open systems and User contributions, but that's a very little comfort. When i heard there was a new OS, and it made it a brand new keyboard , i didn't expect this. This was a big disappointment for me. I like so many things about it. I still have 7 more days to decide if i want to keep it or not. I'm not sure if people from other countries even have such a choice.

nikola81 · Post by **nikola81** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:11 am

As i recall Nedim and some others have posted a detailed procedure for combining sets and it works. It is hard and it is time consuming but how many of you have learned to play over night. Pa is a great keyboard with a great possibilities and that's the thing that makes it hard to use. Some are complaining that is hard to set up aftertouch, that is because it can do a lot of things with sound, not only vibrating sound. As for many more options. And having user sounds makes it hard but what puzzles me the most is that the combining sets on pa80 is more or less same and difficult if you have user sounds and real pain if you have to use flash card to copy samples, and i haven't found any topic in that section, are the pa80 users smarter? And pa1x, i've gone through topics and i haven't seen one (maybe i should look better), on pa1x is way more difficult if you have to load user samples and grooves. And in this section is every second thread on combining sets. How are those guys getting to do that without a software. When you buy a car they wont teach you how to drive, they will just show you the commands.

Demonstrator · Post by **Demonstrator** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 3:02 pm

Hi..

come on guys it is not that bad, combining of sets need time and patience.
I combined 15 set to 3 sets and it took me some weeks.
all you have to do is know the set, (everything in it and cordinations).. and if you don't know the set (name for the samples and sounds) then you got a problem.
my advice will be .. get a laptop by open the word or what ever programn that you can write in it. make some box for each style you need or songs.(in the box write name of the samples) if you used any.
then restore. and load everything in order what you written.
you really have to know the set in and out (REALLY) and you can take the next set you wanna combine with.

it takes surely some time but you have to got patience to do it.

Demo

abo59 · Post by **abo59** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 4:34 pm

I'll wait for the drag-and-drop version!

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 4:40 pm

Andy,
Me to! WEEKS!...we need a better solution...KORG!
Lee