1000v and Pa2x doesn't mix well !

Discussions relating to the Korg Pa2X Pro, Pa800 & Pa500

Moderators: Sharp, X-Trade, Pepperpotty, karmathanever

User avatar
Rob Sherratt
Platinum Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:49 pm

1000v and Pa2x doesn't mix well !

Post by Rob Sherratt »

The fateful day was yesterday (Sunday) at an evening performance in a hotel conference room, Pa2x and vocals with harmony in full swing, using a pair of Alesis M1 520 powered speakers.

One of the audience decided we needed more lights on, so hit the switch that turned on 60 flourescent lights in one go - on a single breaker. What a noise it made via the Alesis powered speakers - sounded like a real bad case of fire crackers exploding in time with the flourescent light display. I guess there were over 300 explosions of back-EMF caused by all those flourescent starters firing at the same time, in the space of about 5 seconds.

Then pfutt - no sound at all. Both speakers ruined, and probably my Pa2x as well. So please forgive me if I sound a bit depressed over the next few weeks :-)
User avatar
rikkisbears
Platinum Member
Posts: 1750
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 3:50 am
Location: NSW , Australia

Re: 1000v and Pa2x doesn't mix well !

Post by rikkisbears »

Hi Rob,
hopefully not.
I'd be depressed too. All the best.
Rob Sherratt wrote: Then pfutt - no sound at all. Both speakers ruined, and probably my Pa2x as well. So please forgive me if I sound a bit depressed over the next few weeks :-)
best wishes
Rikki

HOBBYIST

PA5X 88 note
Wavesart CFX 9ft Grand Piano 🥰
Wavesart Japanese Grand Piano

Roland FP10 piano

Yamaha PSR SX900

Band in a Box 2023
miden
Platinum Member
Posts: 1984
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:20 pm
Location: Australia

Post by miden »

Rob the power supply has an inline fuse, a fast-blow (well it did on the PA1x from memory) so all may not be lost..Open 'er up and have a look, might be as simple as that...

Dennis
User avatar
Rob Sherratt
Platinum Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:49 pm

Post by Rob Sherratt »

Hi Dennis,

In my young engineer days, I saw a Honeywell mainframe computer go up in smoke. One of my colleagues turned all the flourescent lights on in the computer hall via a single breaker. The switch mode PSU broke down and applied mains voltage momentarily to the 5v DC rails causing all of the 5v semiconductors to behave briefly like candles. Every chip in every circuit board was fried. That was expensive, well over 2 million to replace the computer.

Anyway, there is no fuse blown in my Pa2x - but it is powering up in an unusual state and some LED's are either blown or the software/ processor is screwed. Both the Alesis speakers are fried.
chuckdelp46
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 4:44 pm
Location: Danbury CT USA

Post by chuckdelp46 »

Rob - I hope someone had insurance. If not, sounds like it could get very expensive for you. What a shame.
User avatar
dschultze
Full Member
Posts: 204
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 2:17 pm
Location: UK

Post by dschultze »

Rob - this is terrible news and you have my sympathy. I hope that you can salvage something from this and at least get some of the kit repaired.

You must be mortified. :cry:
Cheers

Dave
____________________________
Korg PA4X
User avatar
Rob Sherratt
Platinum Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:49 pm

Post by Rob Sherratt »

I'm following up the insurance questions with the hotel at the moment. Trouble is that here in Greece people solve problems with a shrug of the shoulders, "Avrio" (means tomorrow), and then they walk away. Of course "avrio" is the same answer you get when you see them the next day, and so it goes on.
pcguy
Full Member
Posts: 122
Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:44 pm

Post by pcguy »

That's horrible news. But the thing is that , it can happen any time again. I wonder if there's a device that we could hook our keyboards and speakers to. Something that would control the voltage spikes. Many old buildings have these curcuit problems, especially when you try to plug in some many things .
User avatar
Rob Sherratt
Platinum Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:49 pm

Post by Rob Sherratt »

Apparently the best voltage spike and lightning strike protector on the market is a suitably rated UPS (uninterruptable power supply). These are basically a battery charger driving a big lead acid battery, which then drives an inverter that re-generates a clean mains supply. I wish I had been using one!
User avatar
Sharp
Site Admin
Posts: 18221
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2002 12:29 am
Location: Ireland
Contact:

Post by Sharp »

Hi Rob.

Sorry to hear that.

I have a quick story for you....... My father saw a guy die on stage over exactly what happened to you. Same story, some idiot turned on a ballroom of lights in one go and there was a loud bang from the PA. The lead singer was stuck to the mic, and was killed by a 2200WATT power amp that travelled through the mixing desk to his face, and down to the ground through his body.

So while I'm sure you feel rather pissed off over what happened, take a moment to consider yourself also lucky mate.

As a rule back when I was gigging 7 nights a week, I always played through a UPS, and the singers used radio mics. My own mic was passed through an 01V that was connected to the same UPS the keyboards where.

In my time gigging I'm happy to say that I have never seen the UPS protecting me from a spike. It was usually always a brownout that it kicked in for.

Take care.
Sharp.
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="530"> <tr> <td rowspan="1" colspan="1" width="267" height="94"> <a href="https://shop.korg.com/kronossoundlibraries"><img name="Image110" src="http://www.irishacts.com/images/Image11_1x1.png" width="267" height="94" border="0" alt="KORG Store - Irish Acts"></a></td> <td rowspan="1" colspan="1" width="263" height="94"> <a href="http://www.irishacts.com"><img name="Image111" src="http://www.irishacts.com/images/Image11_1x2.png" width="263" height="94" border="0" alt="Irish Acts Online Store"></a></td> </tr> </table>
greenkidd
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu May 10, 2007 7:03 pm

Re: 1000v and Pa2x doesn't mix well !

Post by greenkidd »

Rob Sherratt wrote:The fateful day was yesterday (Sunday) at an evening performance in a hotel conference room, Pa2x and vocals with harmony in full swing, using a pair of Alesis M1 520 powered speakers.

One of the audience decided we needed more lights on, so hit the switch that turned on 60 flourescent lights in one go - on a single breaker. What a noise it made via the Alesis powered speakers - sounded like a real bad case of fire crackers exploding in time with the flourescent light display. I guess there were over 300 explosions of back-EMF caused by all those flourescent starters firing at the same time, in the space of about 5 seconds.

Then pfutt - no sound at all. Both speakers ruined, and probably my Pa2x as well. So please forgive me if I sound a bit depressed over the next few weeks :-)
Sigh...that is a real bummer. I'm sorry to hear that Rob.
miden
Platinum Member
Posts: 1984
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:20 pm
Location: Australia

Post by miden »

Rob Sherratt wrote:Hi Dennis,

The switch mode PSU broke down and applied mains voltage momentarily to the 5v DC rails causing all of the 5v semiconductors to behave briefly like candles. Every chip in every circuit board was fried. That was expensive, well over 2 million to replace the computer.

Anyway, there is no fuse blown in my Pa2x - but it is powering up in an unusual state and some LED's are either blown or the software/ processor is screwed. Both the Alesis speakers are fried.
Yes, Rob that is very true, it would only take a millisecond of a burst, and from what you have said there are some things a bit amiss.. I really feel for you man, thats about the biggest downer there is for a muso, it would be like losing your right arm I reckon, losing your axe... Anyway, positive vibes are going out on the ether for you.


Dennis
User avatar
Lika
Platinum Member
Posts: 544
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:50 pm
Location: Greece

Post by Lika »

Hi Rob .
It is very sad to hearing your story .:):):)
Yes here (in Greece) is like that - when you have problems ,they say "Avrio" (tomorrow) ...that's why we have to know what we have to do ...
I will try to help you and all of us for the future ...
First - we have to have with us DI boxes every time ( to avoid noise problems of dimmer lights and so on ...)
Then - in Greece (and I guess not only) very often there is a problem with Ground on Power ... What we do ? - We isolate the Ground on our Power ...
That's all ...
I don't know if I explained well - but I did a try ...
User avatar
Rob Sherratt
Platinum Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:49 pm

Post by Rob Sherratt »

I think the lesson for me is that I will get a suitable UPS and connect all mains equipment to that. Sharp's tale convinces me further!
User avatar
PraiseTheLord
Senior Member
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 3:10 am
Location: N Fort Myers, FL, USA

Post by PraiseTheLord »

Sorry to hear this, Rob. I would be beside myself.

Doesn't a surge protector help just as well as a UPS, in terms of protection, that is? Naturally, it doesn't provide the back-up power, but the priority is to protect the equipment.

There is usually some insurance offered with the better surge protectors.
Graham (Pa1000)
Post Reply

Return to “Korg Pa2XPro - Pa800 - Pa500”