new Korg survey on workstations

Discussion relating to the Korg Oasys Workstation.

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Daz
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Post by Daz »

Great essay :-)
Kevin Nolan wrote: I accept your points but I don't feel so downbeat as perhaps you feeling at the moment?
You make a bunch of good points yourself and those are all things that I am very upbeat about. The instrument has many wonderful and inspiring facets, I've just been talking about some of those over KLF in the last few days and I am still getting a big kick out of things like AMS Mixers, AL-1, STR-1 and Karma etc. But this survey, to me, is the second major setback in terms of this flipping program editing feature (the first was the release of the M3 without that feature). So yes I feel downbeat right now, but I'll get over it ;-)
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Post by kenackr »

Kevin Nolan wrote: - OASYS created, IMO, a quite unique forum. Rarely has there been such a positive forum, with such interaction between users and creators.
Kevin
Kevin,

Were you aware that these forums are owned and operated by Sharp and Daz and have no affiliation with Korg? I don't know the birth story of the forums, but I'm not sure that the Oasys created the forum or it's character.

Only Sharp or Daz would be able to tell us that. I do agree that it seems to be unique however.

Ken
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ski
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Post by ski »

Kevin Nolan wrote:The biggest debate for me is Karma.... I worry about its complexity and the amount go knowledge needed to use it effectively. I hope Korg realise what power they have at their disposal, that, with a little more maturing, could deliver even more effective realtime control. But it needs to be tamed IMO - I don't mean dumbed down. Rather the opposite.

For example, currently the 128 variations of a pattern are accessed via one of the contrl surface faders (by default), which is tricky to use/harness. Instead, by default provide an easy graphical front end that shows the patterns, allows you to select the variations, and them and place them in a sequencer track (a bit like STYLUS RMS, for example).

And, rather than having hundreds of parameters changing under the hood, provide a smaller set of variables, perhaps selectable/controlled in a more obvious and visible way; and where note data seamlessly goes to the sequencer to midi ports, to DAW tracks for the major DAWs etc. OR - configure one aspect of Karma as a killer arpeggiator, or package all of KARMA's drum patterns as a killer drum machine.... IMO, Karma needs graphical packaging in these ways to exploit it fully and effectively.
I agree that Karma could/should be "packaged" in a way that makes it easier to grasp and control. However, when you say you worry about its complexity, I would like to offer some friendly advice... don't worry -- just use it, experiment with it. The beauty -- if not the essence of the design of Karma -- is to "do random" against an otherwise programmed pattern. And the degree of control that you have to warp any given pattern is immense but not infinite. The degree to which you will want to more tightly control any particular GE will come only with experimentation and understanding of what that GE does and what the various RT parameters do out-of-the-box. At that point it's time to start reading up on what some of the other Karma parameters do that might help you to control what's going on. But still, Karma GE's aren't generally so all-over-the-place random that you can't make music with them. So just play with Karma and see what it has to offer and don't worry so much! :D
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Post by Daz »

kenackr wrote:
Kevin Nolan wrote: - OASYS created, IMO, a quite unique forum. Rarely has there been such a positive forum, with such interaction between users and creators.
Kevin
Kevin,

Were you aware that these forums are owned and operated by Sharp and Daz and have no affiliation with Korg? I don't know the birth story of the forums, but I'm not sure that the Oasys created the forum or it's character.

Only Sharp or Daz would be able to tell us that. I do agree that it seems to be unique however.

Ken
We aren't affiliated with Korg, it's true. However I can imagine that many people might think we are because we get so much input from Dan. As Kevin says, that has added another dimension to our conversations. I am very appreciative of that.

Daz.
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Post by Kevin Nolan »

kenackr wrote:
Kevin Nolan wrote: - OASYS created, IMO, a quite unique forum. Rarely has there been such a positive forum, with such interaction between users and creators.
Kevin
Kevin,

Were you aware that these forums are owned and operated by Sharp and Daz and have no affiliation with Korg? I don't know the birth story of the forums, but I'm not sure that the Oasys created the forum or it's character.

Only Sharp or Daz would be able to tell us that. I do agree that it seems to be unique however.

Ken
You're absolutely correct Ken regarding Daz's and Sharp's character and committment shaping this forum. My apologies for that oversight.

But to have Korg developers partake, not just as developers but as excited users, is also pretty amazing, and rare.

Cheers,
Kevin.
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Post by kenackr »

I agree whole heartedly!

Ken
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synthguy
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Post by synthguy »

I'm the guy harping about the poly pressure keyboards. :wink:

Since I wanted an Oasys but only had the budget for an M3, that's what I got, and will be digging into that beast for quite a while yet. Hopefully, someday I'll be able to get a polypressure keyboard for it, or that Oasys. With polypressure...
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mdh
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Post by mdh »

Please take my survey answers with a grain of salt.
The questions were all about "what do you do now when recording" and not "what will you use once you get off your lazy butt and read the manual" so really cool stuff like KARMA got a bad rap in my survey answers. Also some things I simply don't use got 50,000 lines to put values in, yet "favourite sounds" only got 4 or 5 which is about 1/10th of my frequently used favourite sounds, let alone stuff I just like, so I was forced to compromise on the answer :(

Conclusion: Korg building a keyboard from this would make about as much sense as Les Paul building a keyboard from this ;)
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Post by jerrythek »

mdh wrote:Please take my survey answers with a grain of salt.
The questions were all about "what do you do now when recording" and not "what will you use once you get off your lazy butt and read the manual" so really cool stuff like KARMA got a bad rap in my survey answers. Also some things I simply don't use got 50,000 lines to put values in, yet "favourite sounds" only got 4 or 5 which is about 1/10th of my frequently used favourite sounds, let alone stuff I just like, so I was forced to compromise on the answer :(

Conclusion: Korg building a keyboard from this would make about as much sense as Les Paul building a keyboard from this ;)
Drat - there go our plans to build a guitar based on the responses!

:?

Seriously - there are plenty of places for open-ended responses to us, so we assumed that there was room for all of your input. But we didn't intend this general approach to how you use/what you want from a korg workstation to include a detailed list of all your favorite specific sounds. That is probably a questionnaire all by itself.

Regards,

Jerry
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Vadim
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Post by Vadim »

is it possible for you guys at KORG to post survey "results" on this forum?

well, not all the answers, but the "multiple choice" type answers?
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mdh
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Post by mdh »

jerrythek wrote: Drat - there go our plans to build a guitar based on the responses!
You never know your luck in a big city.

:P

I didn't mean to sound so critical of the survey before. Must have been a bad day. Sorry Jerry! You're right, there was ample space for other comments and know I mentioned the stuff that matters to me in them.

What I really meant to say was my answers were forced into giving misleading information about KARMA, which I think would be a huge step backwards to remove from future products, and just wanted to give a heads up in case anyone else was also in the same predicament.
Kevin Nolan
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Post by Kevin Nolan »

Some other suggestions -

For Korg to strike a strategic connection with Apple / Logic and for their next generation of workstations to offer:

- OASYS derived capabilities on board the workstation
- Possibility of running OASYS EX's in Logic
- Workstation able to run Logic Instruments on board (without an apple)
- Logic-Lite On board as the workstation sequencer, with excellent exchanging of tracks and settings either way
- For Karma GE's and KO to be available as software options / AU plugins
- Workstation acting as excellent controller for a Logic session

Kevin.
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sirCombatWombat
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Post by sirCombatWombat »

Kevin Nolan wrote:For Korg to strike a strategic connection with Apple / Logic
And I would suggest the same for PC / Sonar, it's only that Roland got there first.

But why not opt for universal solution like VST/RTAS/WhatEver,
that would work even with the lord of them all, Linux.

I am more than a bit skeptical though.
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