Pedal query

[Stephen~K^]

I did a search and did not find a thread where general questions regarding the Oasys can be asked.

My main concern at this point is regarding pedals and control.

I compose, arrange and improv on piano and use sustain and soft pedals frequently.

What can I do to the Oasys whether it be pedals or settings to optimize control for blending and transitions.

For example, I have working on a great sounding string quartet but I cannot seem to blend it properly and it doesn't help matters when the pedal is either on or off, no in between.

I understand that synths and electric pianos have these limitations and have owned both in the past and am hoping that new technology will overcome this.

Any input will be greatly appreciated!

(BTW, as a side note, does anyone out there still use a Moog base pedal? I am looking for one and am interested in how it can be utilized with the O).
SK

[Daz]

I did a search and did not find a thread where general questions regarding the Oasys can be asked.

The idea is that you start a thread suitably titled thread according to the question or comment you have ...

My main concern at this point is regarding pedals and control.

... for example this thread could have had the subject "Pedal Query" (edit: I have changed it to reflect the content of the thread)

For example, I have working on a great sounding string quartet but I cannot seem to blend it properly and it doesn't help matters when the pedal is either on or off, no in between.

Which kind of kind pedal are you using ? There are three types supported by the Oasys; On/Off, Half Damper or Expression pedal. The latter would be better suited to what you're trying to achieve.

Daz.

[Stephen~K^]

I did a search and did not find a thread where general questions regarding the Oasys can be asked.

The idea is that you start a thread suitably titled thread according to the question or comment you have ...

My main concern at this point is regarding pedals and control.

... for example this thread could have had the subject "Pedal Query" (edit: I have changed it to reflect the content of the thread)

For example, I have working on a great sounding string quartet but I cannot seem to blend it properly and it doesn't help matters when the pedal is either on or off, no in between.

Which kind of kind pedal are you using ? There are three types supported by the Oasys; On/Off, Half Damper or Expression pedal. The latter would be better suited to what you're trying to achieve.

Daz.

No problem Daz,

I just thought perhaps there would be a general question/problem solver thread or sticky for the Oasys. I have some other questions and not crazy about starting a thread every time I have a question or problem but if that is how it's done here, it's no problem for me.

Anyway, I asked the store where I bought this about pedal options and they did not know very much so they through in a generic on/off pedal.

I was disappointed that an instrument in this price range did not include a pedal that would help optimize it's performance especially since it is an 88 key piano.

I do see in the operation guide that it mentions the expression pedal and that sounds like what I need.

Thanks for your response!
S

[Daz]

As you have the 88 and are a piano man you should definitely check out the option of getting a half damper type pedal. For your crossfading duties an expression pedal and the Vector joystick are your friends

It's very rare to get a pedal in the box, Kurzweil are one of the few companies that I know that do that. I always ask for a free pedal if I am buying from a store in person and they more often than not oblige. It's a tradition I thought.

Daz.

[Stephen~K^]

As you have the 88 and are a piano man you should definitely check out the option of getting a half damper type pedal. For your crossfading duties an expression pedal and the Vector joystick are your friends

It's very rare to get a pedal in the box, Kurzweil are one of the few companies that I know that do that. I always ask for a free pedal if I am buying from a store in person and they more often than not oblige. It's a tradition I thought.

Daz.

Thanks!

Now I'm excited!

Would rather have pedal than use the Vector since my left hand is also on the keyboard trying to synergize with the right.

I will be shopping for pedals very soon...

S

[rkarlberg]

I think you're in the right place, you can ask individual questions or ask a bunch at once, it happens a lot here, and you'll probably get a lot of responses.

I bought a Roland EV-5 expression pedal, and it works great with the O. You can map it to control almost anything. You can also have a foot switch which would most likely be used to change programs while playing (as Jordan Rudess does). These are in addition to the standard damper pedal.

The Moog pedals are insanely expensive, I just saw some for $3600 on Ebay. I use Roland PK-5 MIDI pedals, which I found on Ebay for less than $400. They are velocity sensitive and polyphonic, and can be used in many ways. You can also find many other MIDI controllers out there to use with the O, it's only limited by your imagination.

[Synergy]

Stephen, you aren't alone and there are few posts relate to the shortfalls you mentioned. If you are a classical trained musician, you'll find the half damper pedal not suitable for your application. Ironically the half damper funciton will frequently cause the sustains to cut off prematurely as if it's stealing your polyphony to a point you feel like you're hicking up constantly. Light pedaling on a piece by Chopin will cause the hick ups. I found the Oasys piano a bit unatural and not blending enough for the size of sample it uses. I adjusted the velocity of the keyboard, release, reverb, eq among others but I think the primary reason is the factory parameters related to the keybed sensors and the sustain pedal. I did try the Yamaha Nocturne and the piano sounds were I dare to say even better than the real thing (not the one that cost ten grands). On the Norctune, the location of the velocity trigger and the release points of the sensors in regard to the travel path along the key and the sustain pedal seem to be well positioned in that it was easy to control the subtle nuances just with your fingers without much of the assistance from a pedal. I hardly used the sustain pedal to suppliment the expressions while I was on it than I was on the Oasys. There remains a question whether there be a future remedy on this matter.

[Stephen~K^]

I think you're in the right place, you can ask individual questions or ask a bunch at once, it happens a lot here, and you'll probably get a lot of responses.

I bought a Roland EV-5 expression pedal, and it works great with the O. You can map it to control almost anything. You can also have a foot switch which would most likely be used to change programs while playing (as Jordan Rudess does). These are in addition to the standard damper pedal.

The Moog pedals are insanely expensive, I just saw some for $3600 on Ebay. I use Roland PK-5 MIDI pedals, which I found on Ebay for less than $400. They are velocity sensitive and polyphonic, and can be used in many ways. You can also find many other MIDI controllers out there to use with the O, it's only limited by your imagination.

Thanks much RK,

The Moog pedal is one that I will not mark off of my list but in the meantime I will definitely check out the Roland's that you mentioned.

It's funny that you mention the Ebay listings, I saw my first synth, the Roland system 100 listed for over $3,000 and it didn't even have the mixer!

I am hopeful that I will find the Moog base pedal at a decent price.

Please keep it in mind if you happen to get a lead on one. It is a great piece of work from the Moog collection and I can imagine the low end rumbling through me just thinking about it...

Regards,
sk

[danatkorg]

If you are a classical trained musician, you'll find the half damper pedal not suitable for your application.

There remains a question whether there be a future remedy on this matter.

In version 1.1, we added the capability to enable/disable the half-damper's modulation of release time, on a per-Program basis. I'd suggest turning this off, and seeing what you think!

- Dan

[Stephen~K^]

Stephen, you aren't alone and there are few posts relate to the shortfalls you mentioned. If you are a classical trained musician, you'll find the half damper pedal not suitable for your application. Ironically the half damper funciton will frequently cause the sustains to cut off prematurely as if it's stealing your polyphony to a point you feel like you're hicking up constantly. Light pedaling on a piece by Chopin will cause the hick ups. I found the Oasys piano a bit unatural and not blending enough for the size of sample it uses. I adjusted the velocity of the keyboard, release, reverb, eq among others but I think the primary reason is the factory parameters related to the keybed sensors and the sustain pedal. I did try the Yamaha Nocturne and the piano sounds were I dare to say even better than the real thing (not the one that cost ten grands). On the Norctune, the location of the velocity trigger and the release points of the sensors in regard to the travel path along the key and the sustain pedal seem to be well positioned in that it was easy to control the subtle nuances just with your fingers without much of the assistance from a pedal. I hardly used the sustain pedal to suppliment the expressions while I was on it than I was on the Oasys. There remains a question whether there be a future remedy on this matter.

Synergy,

Yes, classically trained for a short time (American Conservatory, Chicago) but this was many years ago and then and many years of nothing to follow.
Bartok's Mikrokosmos still hangs with me though...

You have pinpointed exactly what I am trying to describe.
I know it's not realistic to expect electronic instruments to emulate everything that a good acoustic can do. I still have my Yamaha U1 that is a joy to play.

Either way, I am thrilled with the Oasys and am just trying to find ways to express myself with it the best that I can.

BTW, "Synergy" Chords is my favorite synth/electronic album of all time.
It is hard to believe what was accomplished on that album given the time that it was made...
sk

[Stephen~K^]

[quote="danatkorg
In version 1.1, we added the capability to enable/disable the half-damper's modulation of release time, on a per-Program basis. I'd suggest turning this off, and seeing what you think!

- Dan[/quote]

Thanks Dan!

I am on a mission to get the half damper pedal today...

s

[EJ2]

[quote="danatkorg
In version 1.1, we added the capability to enable/disable the half-damper's modulation of release time, on a per-Program basis. I'd suggest turning this off, and seeing what you think!

- Dan

Thanks Dan!

I am on a mission to get the half damper pedal today...

s

And don't forget to calibrate it from Global mode after you plug it in. You should not experience misaligned sustains or cut-offs etc.

[Synergy]

In version 1.1, we added the capability to enable/disable the half-damper's modulation of release time, on a per-Program basis. I'd suggest turning this off, and seeing what you think!
- Dan

Dan, will there be a remedy on the half damper functionality itself rather than disabling it? I paid extra ($80) for the Korg's half damper pedal. I do hear the half damper in action if I listen carefully. But the trigger & the release point of the half damper is so short and awkwardly close to the null position in that you have to press the pedal carefully and precisely on the right spot to activate the effect. Otherwise using the pedal would either smear the tune with long sustains or everyting else would sound like Bach, but not in between (aside from the notes being cut off).

Also I might have to add that though the EXs-2 piano samples are huge in size and have some cool extra detail characteristics of the sustain echoing internal chamber like effect when the pedal is being depressed, such chamber effects cause greater contrast when the sustain is not triggered. I did go back to the EXs-1 piano, and it was less obvious for that very reason. Ironically I do prefer the quality of the EXs-2's grand piano samples, hence my dilemma of whether to diable the half damper, or stick with the EXs-1 rather than the EXs-2.

[danatkorg]

In version 1.1, we added the capability to enable/disable the half-damper's modulation of release time, on a per-Program basis. I'd suggest turning this off, and seeing what you think!
- Dan

But the trigger & the release point of the half damper is so short and awkwardly close to the null position in that you have to press the pedal carefully and precisely on the right spot to activate the effect.

This doesn't sound like the pedal is operating correctly. It sounds like it might be good to re-calibrate the pedal. You can do this using the menu command in global mode. Try this and see if it improves your experience with the pedal.

Also I might have to add that though the EXs-2 piano samples are huge in size and have some cool extra detail characteristics of the sustain echoing internal chamber like effect when the pedal is being depressed, such chamber effects cause greater contrast when the sustain is not triggered. I did go back to the EXs-1 piano, and it was less obvious for that very reason. Ironically I do prefer the quality of the EXs-2's grand piano samples, hence my dilemma of whether to diable the half damper, or stick with the EXs-1 rather than the EXs-2.

If you prefer the EXs1 piano resonance multisample, you could also simply try editing the Program to use that one instead. I'm not sure how this relates the half-damper, however; perhaps you can clarify.

- Dan

[Stephen~K^]

All,

Thanks much for your replies.

I bought the DS-1H and I am very pleased with it.

I now have a verson of the EXs2 concert grand tweaked the way I like it and it sounds terrific!

On some transitions I found that it takes a precise and quick off/on touch of the pedal and cannot "cheat" or be lazy with my foot as I sometimes do with my acoustic.

sk