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maphill Full Member
Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 217
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Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:06 pm Post subject: A fix for sticky keys and clunky B's and C's |
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I think I remember someone saying that some of their keys sounded (acoustically) different that others. I had most of the B's, C's and some D's that had a slightly different clunk than others.
What was worse was a couple B's were harder to depress. They were sticking.
I found the problem was insufficient space between the front of the white keys and the front portion of the body. A couple keys were actually coming into contact and sticking.
The solution? With the keyboard on the stand, I loosened the large-headed bolts and then inserted the cardboard inserts that came with the unit. With these bolts loose, the keybed was able to slightly move back as I inserted the spacers. I re-tightened the bolts, removed the inserts, and enjoyed an even, non-sticking feel once again.
I could imagine that the keybed could possibly shift slightly during shipment, especially if the spacers weren't in place and the keyboard was "front down". I can see why Korg recommends using the spacers during shipment as a just in case.
For those of you brave enough to open your unit, I'd recommend the spacers are in place during the operation to ensure proper alignment during re-assembly.
Hope this helps someone.
Mark
P.S. PLEASE! Do NOT clutter this thread with posts about opinions, speculations, and complaints, there are plenty of other threads already covering that. Information and relevant questions only. Thanks. _________________ Korg KRONOS 73, Trinity Pro, Monotron,
Roland FA-06 and Fantom 6, Roland TDK-15
Big Knob, Sonar (Previously, OASYS 76) |
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panrixx Senior Member
Joined: 13 May 2011 Posts: 448 Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall, UK
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:22 am Post subject: |
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Should be getting delivery of my K88 on Tuesday, so are the large-headed bolts you refer to obvious? _________________ Rhodes 73 Mk1; Kronos 88; Synthex; Electribe EMX-1; Motif XS Rack; Yamaha DX7IIFD; Yamaha MM8; Roland Alpha Juno-2; Roland JV-2080; Tascam FW-1884. |
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maphill Full Member
Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 217
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:40 am Post subject: |
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panrixx wrote: | Should be getting delivery of my K88 on Tuesday, so are the large-headed bolts you refer to obvious? |
Yes, there are only 2 bolt sizes: Some very flat-ish ones and then some larger ones that stick out noticeably more. Both are #2 phillips I believe.
Mark _________________ Korg KRONOS 73, Trinity Pro, Monotron,
Roland FA-06 and Fantom 6, Roland TDK-15
Big Knob, Sonar (Previously, OASYS 76) |
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billysynth1 Platinum Member
Joined: 22 Jan 2005 Posts: 1148 Location: Australia/Melbourne
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:35 am Post subject: |
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I got my 88 yesterday. The keys on this board are strange to say the least. Grab any one of the black keys and pull it forward it bangs against the white keys and then springs back. You can also do the same with the white keys...just press on a white key and pull forward down to the casing, you will hear a bang each time your pull it down and hit the casing. It then springs back...Whats this bull crap about????
Who created this keybed...??
This does not happen on my Oasys88, JP80 or Vsynth.
Why isnt the chasis metal or hard plastic, its that cheap wood mds or whatever its called, rub you hand under the board it feels as though bits of chip wood are going to fall off. I have mine sitting a top of my oasys.
Good luck to all you dudes taking it on the road with you.
Billy _________________ Yamaha C1 Grand Piano.
Korg Oasys 88, Jupiter 80
Kronos 88, V Synth GT
I am a student of classical piano...I am not a classical pianist. |
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sparkie Platinum Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 743 Location: Indiana
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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billysynth1 wrote: | I got my 88 yesterday. The keys on this board are strange to say the least. Grab any one of the black keys and pull it forward it bangs against the white keys and then springs back. You can also do the same with the white keys...just press on a white key and pull forward down to the casing, you will hear a bang each time your pull it down and hit the casing. It then springs back...Whats this bull crap about????
Who created this keybed...??
This does not happen on my Oasys88, JP80 or Vsynth.
Why isnt the chasis metal or hard plastic, its that cheap wood mds or whatever its called, rub you hand under the board it feels as though bits of chip wood are going to fall off. I have mine sitting a top of my oasys.
Good luck to all you dudes taking it on the road with you.
Billy |
SAD .....I believe the wood is called "pressed board" or composition. It is the cheapest grade of wood below plywood. They use it mainly on flooring and in places that usually get covered up by another material. It is actually wood chips and sawdust that is glued and then pressed together into a sheet of wood. Dont get it wet either...... |
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burningbusch Approved Merchant
Joined: 30 Jan 2005 Posts: 1203 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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sparkie wrote: |
SAD .....I believe the wood is called "pressed board" or composition. It is the cheapest grade of wood below plywood. They use it mainly on flooring and in places that usually get covered up by another material. It is actually wood chips and sawdust that is glued and then pressed together into a sheet of wood. Dont get it wet either...... |
Are you for real? I don't think I've owned an weighted 88 key keyboard in the last 10+ years that hasn't used this same composite wood. No one uses plywood and no one attaches it to metal (the only exception MIGHT be Nord). But check out Yamaha and Roland and you'll see. I've got a Roland RD300GX with the side panel off and it's clearly composite wood. The underside is covered with plastic. This wood is less likely to warp than plywood or solid wood.
I have a Yamaha Avant Grand N3 and the entire case is composite wood.
Busch. |
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sani Senior Member
Joined: 22 Jul 2002 Posts: 354 Location: Croatia
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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billysynth1 wrote: | I got my 88 yesterday. The keys on this board are strange to say the least. Grab any one of the black keys and pull it forward it bangs against the white keys and then springs back. You can also do the same with the white keys...just press on a white key and pull forward down to the casing, you will hear a bang each time your pull it down and hit the casing. It then springs back...Whats this bull crap about???? |
The last time I played a piano, the keys certainly had space and could be slightly moved. I was even able to raise the keys up to a certain extent. It could be that your playing style is radically different to mine, but I usually don't pull the keys back and forward. I just play them by pressing them down. And BTW, you probably know that comparing the Kronos88 keys with the ones on the JP80/V-Synth doesn't make any sense for a couple of reasons!
billysynth1 wrote: | Why isnt the chasis metal or hard plastic, its that cheap wood mds or whatever its called, rub you hand under the board it feels as though bits of chip wood are going to fall off. I have mine sitting a top of my oasys. |
That's very often used on those big 88key versions. You'll find the same under a Fantom or Motif.
billysynth1 wrote: | Good luck to all you dudes taking it on the road with you. |
Thank you. There are actually quite a lot of people touring day in day out with their Kronos or a keyboard with the same RH3 keybed or with a keyboard with the same cheap wood mds. No problem so far. I don't pull on things which are intended to be pressed and I don't bother myself with some conceptual concerns if there is nothing to worry about. It's an instrument and you have to take some care about it. Drums are made of wood and/or wood based components, guitars, amp boxes, and nobody complains. There is no reason to be paranoid about everything. |
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X-Trade Moderator
Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 6494 Location: Leeds, UK
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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Metal isn't actually a popular material for larger and more delicate systems because it expands and contracts more than wood does.
It's called MDF by the way - medium density fibreboard. Basically as said elsewhere here, fine wood dust and chippings reconstituted into a solid material using glue. Not that different to the material used for some hamburgers in certain fast food chains...
I think others have got the point quite well here - instruments do have to be taken care of. I don't let anyone else move my equipment unless I really know they will take care of it. _________________ Current Gear: Kronos 61, RADIAS-R, Volca Bass, ESX-1, microKorg, MS2000B, R3, Kaossilator Pro +, MiniKP, AX3000B, nanoKontrol, nanoPad MK II,
Other Mfgrs: Moog Sub37, Roland Boutique JX03, Novation MiniNova, Akai APC40, MOTU MIDI TimePiece 2, ART Pro VLA, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40.
Past Gear: Korg Karma, TR61, Poly800, EA-1, ER-1, ES-1, Kawai K1, Novation ReMote37SL, Boss GT-6B
Software: NI Komplete 10 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, Ableton Live 9. Apple OSX El Capitan on 15" MacBook Pro |
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panrixx Senior Member
Joined: 13 May 2011 Posts: 448 Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall, UK
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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My Yamaha MM8 has the same composite base and there have never been any problems. It's a base and for this component of the keyboard it serves it's purpose well. _________________ Rhodes 73 Mk1; Kronos 88; Synthex; Electribe EMX-1; Motif XS Rack; Yamaha DX7IIFD; Yamaha MM8; Roland Alpha Juno-2; Roland JV-2080; Tascam FW-1884. |
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maphill Full Member
Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 217
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 11:21 pm Post subject: Re: A fix for sticky keys and clunky B's and C's |
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maphill wrote: |
P.S. PLEASE! Do NOT clutter this thread with posts about opinions, speculations, and complaints, there are plenty of other threads already covering that. Information and relevant questions only. Thanks. |
A reminder: Post questions or relevant information. No complaining in this thread. Or challenging others approaches. This has a very straightforward thread title, let's stick to it.
Thanks,
Mark _________________ Korg KRONOS 73, Trinity Pro, Monotron,
Roland FA-06 and Fantom 6, Roland TDK-15
Big Knob, Sonar (Previously, OASYS 76) |
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MarPabl Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Sep 2011 Posts: 938 Location: MX
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Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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Ok I can confirm that maphill's solution worked for my Kronos 88, RH3 keybed from Japan.
I had clicking notes on C3-C4 and C5-C6 and by removing those large-headed bolts I was able to eliminate the clicking noises.
I repeated the procedure several times, because when I adjusted some keys, then other (C6-C7) began to make the clicking noise.
My last shot was to put all my bank statements in front of all the keys, then put again those bolts and removing those bank statements. After all, I've found a proper use to those bank acounts LOL _________________ Current gear: Access Virus TI2 Whiteout Keyboard (111/150), Access Virus TI2 Polar DarkStar Special Edition, Gibson Custom Lite 2013, Roland MV-8800 |
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PinkFloydDudi Guest
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Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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billysynth1 wrote: | I got my 88 yesterday. The keys on this board are strange to say the least. Grab any one of the black keys and pull it forward it bangs against the white keys and then springs back. You can also do the same with the white keys...just press on a white key and pull forward down to the casing, you will hear a bang each time your pull it down and hit the casing. It then springs back...Whats this bull crap about????
Billy |
WTF?
I heard if you hit the key with a hammer it will act strangely too.
Seriously though - what are you pulling on keys for? If you pull hard enough, you can destroy any keyboard!
if I lift up on any 61-key individual key, it will snap. I blame the manufacturer?
I definitely think the OP had a great solution to what seems to be a problem experienced by a few. Seems like the metal will simply come loose at times - maybe due to the screws not being tightened enough?
Hopefully it helps most of you - but I doubt any solution will solve toddler-like behavior some folks are putting their keybeds through!!!
I don't have any clicking. I'm curious if those of you that are experience it more in the middle of the keyboard or towards the ends? I would think the metal bending woudl cause it to happen more towards the middle of the keys?
Just curious if that may be the case |
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madbeatzyo111 Guest
Joined: 13 Jun 2011 Posts: 379
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Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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My (high end) Roland DP also uses MDF for the bottom panel. It bothers me and I wish they had used a different material, but I assume it's needed for its light weight and acoustic properties--maybe to damp out the hammer action noise, etc. You'll find MDF in most speaker/monitor housing too.
The keys are rock solid and don't move in any way other than up and down. However, they do also make a loud clunking sound--in fact I'm pretty sure PHAIII is one of the loudest hammer actions, probably louder than RH3 and certainly more than GHA. |
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rockstar898
Joined: 22 Oct 2011 Posts: 13 Location: Murrells Inlet, SC
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:21 pm Post subject: THANK YOU MARK! |
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Mark - I'm on my 3rd Kronos. My first one had the dreaded double hammer problem so bad it was unplayable, so Guitar Center paid to ship it back and sent me a replacement, which also had the problem, although not as bad.
At that point, GC put me in contact with Korg, who directly sent me a new Kronos last week, straight off of the boat from Japan. It came with the new keybed (I could tell a dramatic difference in feel and playability from the first two), and it had the 1.5.2 OS already installed. With the double hammer issue resolved, I now had this very annoying and loud clonky click on 4 keys: the B below middle C, and G/A/B two octaves higher.
I REALLY didn't want to have to go through another technical support call or possible replacement, and your 5 minute fix completely solved the problem. Now, finally, my Kronos sounds AND plays like a million bucks.
Thanks dude!
J _________________ http://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/while-heaven-wept/id428163662
http://www.whileheavenwept.com/whw-band/whw-profiles/78-jason-lingle
Gear: Korg KRONOS 88, Korg Trinity 61, Roland V-Synth GT 2, Korg nanoKey2, Presonus FireStudio Project, Novation ZeRO MKII Control Surface
Software: Korg Legacy Digital Collection, M-Tron Pro Virtual Mellotron, Komplete 8, 8dio.com's Requiem & Liberis AllChoir Bundle, 8dio Adagio Violins, Melodyne Studio 3
DAW: Logic 9.1.8 on OS X Lion 10.8.2 |
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maphill Full Member
Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 217
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: THANK YOU MARK! |
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rockstar898 wrote: | ...
I REALLY didn't want to have to go through another technical support call or possible replacement, and your 5 minute fix completely solved the problem. Now, finally, my Kronos sounds AND plays like a million bucks.
Thanks dude!
J |
You're welcome! Thanks for the feedback.
My unit is currently at the shop getting the new keybed... I'm looking forward to it. But anyway, I took along my spacers and let the tech know to use them when tightening the new keybed into place.
Mark _________________ Korg KRONOS 73, Trinity Pro, Monotron,
Roland FA-06 and Fantom 6, Roland TDK-15
Big Knob, Sonar (Previously, OASYS 76) |
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