Best way to import Kontakt library

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Sun Aug 26, 2012 6:21 pm

I like the name "Kronik"

I need to hold off comment until certain things are done. We do have a autosampler inhouse here but it's just off the audio inputs, not directly off VST or CoreAudio. But one can always just take a cable and route it around.

Samplit is old, the single-person companies tend to product something and then they are off doing something else.

Broadwave · Post by **Broadwave** » Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:29 pm

Out of curiosity and fear of stereo SF2 files not loading correctly, I resampled my favourite CP80 patch from my Fantom using Samplit and then exported it to a stereo SF2, held my breath and loaded it into the Kronos...

All's well, no problems. All samples in the right place and layered correctly, none of that -L/-R renaming palaver so I'm a happy bunny.

Now I just need to find some time for a major sampling session.

@chickeneps - i like the name Kronik too... That's the state my mind was in the first time I powered up the Kronos and thought "Where do I start?"

Post by **Sharp** » Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:36 pm

All known SF2 issues have been fixed in 2.0
The video's I posted on how to patch a SF2 file is pretty much obsolete now.

Regards
Sharp.

pfrocha · Post by **pfrocha** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 2:25 am

I'm a not a big Kontakt man, so forgive me if my question is not appropriate.

Are we able to import these samples into Kronos from Kontakt?

http://www.orangetreesamples.com/evolut ... strawberry

BasariStudios · Post by **BasariStudios** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 2:56 am

No, you cant Import those, you have to resample them and if you resample
it would be nothing like it is in those Demos. This is done with Scripts.

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:18 am

Basari makes an excellent point.

Some of the appeal of these monster Kontakt libraries is the sound, but most of the appeal is real-time abilities; that is, how they play. That's something you can't port over, considering Kontakt is extremely powerful.

"Scripting" in this sense is the ability to track and monitor MIDI playing - sort of an AI thing - and patterns and tie them into how the sound engine behaves. Kontakt took some of the pioneering technologies and took it to the next level. The Kronos has neither the ability to do this AI nor can reference the amount of sounds necessary to make this work.

(An added-note: none of the autosamplers these days does any deconstruction for you. What if you are sampling something that has this gorgeous convolution reverb on it? You can turn it off in the VI and then reprogram it on your Kronos, but that's not AUTO sampling.)

I don't think auto-sampling real-life sounds (like strings, trumpets, woodwinds, etc.) is worth it. If you already have the Kontakt library - which can play itself on the computer since it comes with the very players its supposed to play on - use that. I don't understand the desire to use it on the Kronos, unless it's a starting point for something else creative. It's like owning a Ferrari, getting a old Volkswagen Beetle and thinking "if I can just put the Ferrari engine in the VW I can go faster!" Just drive the Ferrari.

When we are talking about importing sounds into the Kronos, IMHO we should be looking at what the Kronos does best, and what it needs to round it out. I really dislike closed-systems where all I've got is the internal ROM stuff. Much of my musician time I'm being asked to imitate things and I like getting the EXACT sound. The ability to import stuff in makes the onboard stuff that much more powerful. I'm not looking at REPLACING the ROM stuff, I'm looking at complimenting it.

A Kronos Program only has up to 2 oscillators, each can play two multisamples (EDIT) at a time. That isn't very much and doing real-life instruments needs more referencing than that. There's no round robin, controller switching or crossfading. Any autosampling of even the best library is just static, it doesn't DO anything which is the life of a great orchestral library. The solution is simple - just play it back on what you have, the player that came with the library.

I don't auto-sample much but when I do, it's getting unique stuff, like Symphobia orchestra effects or True Strike custom percussion from ProjectSAM, or the cool pads out of Omnisphere, or guitar effects. That rounds out the Kronos and gives it room to grow. Nothing against the Kronos but after one year of any ROMpler, I already know it's sonic limits and I'm onto something else.

Dniss · Post by **Dniss** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 5:46 am

I can't talk for anyone else here but since I do live gig having everything in the Kronos jsut makes more sense.

I use Kontakt in Muse Receptor for gigs, which is already live performance tuned, but I'd still rather port the sound onto the Kronos if I could.

Of course it will be nothing like that guitar package. I don't need any of that elaborated stuff.

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:17 pm

Playing live takes the pressure off the quality angle - when you are running through PA's etc. (forgive the generalization) most orchestral libraries sound the same.

But you want to get the unique sounds, like the loops, the unique sounds, etc. in the Kronos, yes, that's the nice thing about it being open-ended with the HD-1 programs and multisamples.

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:03 pm

chickeneps wrote:
A Kronos Program only has 2 oscillators, each can play one multisample at a time. That isn't very much and doing real-life instruments needs more referencing than that. There's no round robin, controller switching or crossfading. Any autosampling of even the best library is just static, it doesn't DO anything which is the life of a great orchestral library. The solution is simple - just play it back on what you have, the player that came with the library.

Nothing against the Kronos but after one year of any ROMpler, I already know it's sonic limits and I'm onto something else.

There is so much mis-information here.

Each Kronos OSC supports layering of two multisamples, not just one. You can do round robin via wave sequencing. Check out the vector joystick on most factory patches to hear the sonic X-fading/controller switching possibilities. You can do crossfading of the multisamples in the OSC and you can crossfade via wave sequencing. Note: wave sequencing is not just about rhythmic sequences. And do remember that combi mode is there for you to create more complex PROGRAMS if you run into limits at the Program level.

I have a Mac Pro 8 core with 10 GB RAM and 7 TB of disk. I have tens of thousands of dollars investing in software and software libraries. Yes it's great stuff for the most part (but I've purchased plenty of stuff where the scripting just doesn't deliver as promised and comes off as more of a gimmick). But it can't deliver the ultra low latency that the Kronos does with ZERO glitches. And you can't instant pull up thousands of complex sounds like you can on the Kronos with an interface list Set List. The ability to have tight programming of the control surface to the program just isn't there in software. I've done a fair amount of importing of my own/others sampling into Kontakt and now the Kronos. I have to say I enjoy working with the Kronos more. I can build a program using as many FXs as I need, something that's very limited within Kontakt.

Busch.

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:40 pm

(EDIT: incorrect info, a Oscillator can layer two multisamples, see below. And also Round Robin can be imitated using WaveSequences with Note-On Advance turned on. Thank you Busch for the correction.)

My understanding is that each Oscillator can REFERENCE 8 multisamples but they can't overlap velocities. In Dual mode you get another oscillator, but each of them can only PLAY one MS simultaneously.

The Triton was the same way but only 2 velocity slots. But still only 2 MS's (one per Oscillator) can play simultaneously, thats what I've always known.

(You are right about Combis, I just don't like to use them so quickly, I wish the Programs could handle a little more.)

Also, all sampled Multisamples are mono, so when dealing with stereo there's no other way than to assign left to one MS, right to the other MS and run the Program in Dual. Basically a Program is a stereo player, 2 channels only.

My apologies if that's incorrect; if so, please explain how I can play 2 sampled MS's at a time, in a Program, in Single mode. I don't mind being wrong, but looking the manual and programming in the unit strongly tells me 2x8.

Round Robin is defined historically as "hit a key at velocity X, play a piece of wavedata, next strike at same key/vel plays a different piece of wavedata". Your suggestion seems intriguing - how is it done with Wave Sequencing? Is there an example?

Thanks for clarifying.

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 5:23 pm

chickeneps wrote:My understanding is that each Oscillator can REFERENCE 8 multisamples but they can't overlap velocities. In Dual mode you get another oscillator and each can PLAY one MS at a time.

The Triton was the same way but only 2 velocity slots. But still only 2 MS's (one per Oscillator) can play simultaneously, is what I've always known.

(You are right about Combis, I just don't like to use them so quickly, I wish the Programs could handle a little more.)

Also, all sampled Multisamples are mono, so when dealing with stereo there's no other way than to assign left to one MS, right to the other MS and run the Program in Dual.

My apologies if that's incorrect; if so, please explain how I can play 2 sampled MS's at a time, in a Program, in Single mode. I don't mind being wrong, but looking the manual and programming in the unit strongly tells me 2x8.

Round Robin is defined historically as "hit a key at velocity X, play a piece of wavedata, next strike at same key/vel plays a different piece of wavedata". Your suggestion seems intriguing - how is it done with Wave Sequencing? Is there an example?

Thanks for clarifying.

Look at the CURVE parameter in the OSC/PITCH PAGE for each multisample. If set to LAYER and the top MS has an Xfade range of 127, you can layer two multsamples per OSC.

Check out INT-B095 PIPE FULL ORGAN for an example of this. Also note in this patch that there is one mono and one stereo MS per OSC. The Kronos supports mono or stereo per OSC and with both OSCs (Dual) you can have up to 16 stereo velocity layers per program. You do not need to split mono left/right using both OSCs.

Within wave sequencing you can turn on NOTE ADVANCE in which each new note will trigger a new MS. The Korg Legendary Strings make extensive use of Round Robin wave sequencing for stacc and pizz. If you look at the Wave Sequence data that loads with Legendary Strings you'll find other ways the wave sequences are used.

Busch.

Busch.

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 5:33 pm

A better example of stereo MS in one OSC is INT-B 004: 3 Way stereo Grand

Busch.

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Thu Aug 30, 2012 7:12 pm

Thanks, I stand complete and pleasantly CORRECTED. =)

I've edited my past posts to be accurate. Thanks for catching that.

Very interesting on the Round Robin, Note-On Advance.

popmann · Post by **popmann** » Sat Sep 01, 2012 5:32 am

I need to convert my MojoHorns ensembles...now that we have disk streaming. It's the last remaining thing I even open Kontakt for....that app, and the industry's support of it is one of the major reasons I bought a Kronos after a decade of exclusive software instruments.

chickeneps · Post by **chickeneps** » Sat Sep 01, 2012 12:24 pm

This is drawing out sort of a OT question, but I assume you have a problem with Kontakt? And you find it a problem that it is popular? Why?

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