KARO presents:"KEP Electric Piano" in a higher lev

markuk · Post by **markuk** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:33 pm

Is it $148 for Grand Pianos I-III or are I. II and III each $148?

Kevin Nolan · Post by **Kevin Nolan** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:56 pm

EWBR wrote:

The grands and electric pianos needs a good amount of memory. I remember they are unlooped! Every item has a size about 1 and 1.5 GB.
We managed the max. amount of samples. I think more is not possible at the moment.

Oliver
KARO Sound Development
medusaland & EWBR

All these posts are beginning to confuse me. Could you clarifying the following:

- What each $148 bundle contains

- Whether there are 4-layer piano programs or whether each of the 4 velocities represents four different programs of different moods - separate p, mp, mf and ff programs with one layer each for example?

- Whether velocity layering information associated with each program is contained in the product notes/manual

- How much RAM is taken up:
---By each CDROM sold
---By each piano
---Whether individual piano's can be loaded and if so the minimum amount or RAM required for each.

It's slightly concerning to hear of figures of 1-1.5 GB RAM for individual pianos. Although excellent from a quality stand point, it sounds a little OTT for just 4 layers. Does this make your pianos unusable alongside your Philharmonic Strings or EXs3? If so, could you provide scaled down versions for a more realistic and flexible setup alongside other sample packages. My reasoning is that, at 4 layers, it is unlikely that these pianos will be used in solo mode in a recording setup given other sample packages at 20+ layers. Hence your pianos are more likely to be useful alongside your strings and EXs3 in film an TV work and any recordings looking for generally good acoustic instrument emulations in a mix. So to release individual pianos at 1.5 GB each for OASYS is far from ideal given just 4 layers.

Also - any chance of putting a demo of the CP70 on your web site?

Finally - can you say a little more about the Fender Rhodes programs - How many layers are they? How tweak-able are these in terms of tone? Are the Fender Rhodes setups described in the product notes.

Thanks,
Kevin.

EWBR · Post by **EWBR** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:30 pm

Arend Groot · Post by **Arend Groot** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:11 pm

Great demos

I was wondering if the piano programs are using the damper resonance?

EWBR · Post by **EWBR** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:33 pm

sebbytriton · Post by **sebbytriton** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 8:22 pm

Does damper resonance is treated with Exs-2 ?

Kevin Nolan · Post by **Kevin Nolan** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 8:42 pm

EWBR

That each load is a minimum of 1GB and that you are not planning scaled down versions is, in my opinion, a great pity:

- You are ruling out using your pianos on the OASYS for film and TV type work because these piano releases cannot be used along side Karo strings and EXs3. Can you clarify further - is each piano 500MB or 1GB+?

- You are ruling out using both an acoustic piano and the various electric pianos in a live situation akin to the Nord Stage. Really frustrating.

Surely 1 GB is not needed for a 4 layer piano - Korg have already proved this with their excellent on board EXs2. I accept that more RAM gives better quality, but the OASYS cannot compete with dedicated sample libraries, hence surely the priority of flexible usage scenarios is important strategically both for OASYS users and your business model?

Most of us have a fixed method of using the OASYS and loading individual 1GB pianos is not going to work for many. Surely a 500MB limit would have allowed for a straight swap for EXs2 and/or for several sample packages to be loaded. The extra 'quality' your preserving - such as offering at 48kHz insteat of 44.1kHz, and longer non-looped samples will be mitigated by the lack of layers whici will always override. I'm speaking from some experience here where, for example, I find it impossible to play the likes of a Beethoven Sonata or Debussy piece on either EXs2 or on my K2500XS even with K-Sound Steinway - there simply aren't enough layers and the dynamic response of the sound to velocity doesn't sounds right, despite my lengthy efforts to solve this through velocity curve settings etc.). Hence I recommend that offering 500MB pianos for 'general' and adequate piano playing in a mix, or live on stage, is far more valuable in the OASYS than preserving envelope tails that can never be effectively harnessed (While the demo of the Pathetique on your website is played well, it's dynamics are out and I'm convinced it could not be played convincingly through to completion).

It'd be great if in the near future you could repackage / upgrade / scale down your various sample packages to allow them to be used effectively in the sorts of scenarios suitable to the OASYS 2GB RAM limit mentioned above. I feel you've lost an opportunity with these releases. Using all OASYS RAM as a solo piano at 4 layers, when 20 - 30 layer pianos are available, is surely a lesser priority than imporving the OASYS overal felxability?

Kevin.

Arend Groot · Post by **Arend Groot** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 8:58 pm

Hi Arend,
Thanks for the demos.
About the damper resonance, not at the moment. We would need more memory or disc streaming. The next problem could be the sample management. The actual size is the highest score at the moment.

EWBR
KARO Sound Development
medusaland & EWBR

Then the only way is to use the damper resonance from the EX1 133 mb piano and use that 1oscellator in a combi.

EWBR · Post by **EWBR** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:01 am

peter m. mahr · Post by **peter m. mahr** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:57 am

EWBR wrote: My choice is the external sequencer, because the handling for me is easier.

!!!!!

External sequencers like dp6, logic and cubase are playing in a different league. And it is not only the fact that they provide more MIDI and Audio tracks but also give access to PlugIns like the ones from UAudio - ok only with their PCI dongle - and Sonalksis e.a. which are excellent.

peter

medusaland · Post by **medusaland** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:51 am

- You are ruling out using both an acoustic piano and the various electric pianos in a live situation akin to the Nord Stage. Really frustrating.

Surely 1 GB is not needed for a 4 layer piano - Korg have already proved this with their excellent on board EXs2. I accept that more RAM gives better quality, but the OASYS cannot compete with dedicated sample libraries, hence surely the priority of flexible usage scenarios is important strategically both for OASYS users and your business model?

Kevin.[/quote]

Hi Oasyans,

KARO create the best available grand and e-pianos for the Oasys!
Nord Stage, Fantoms and Motivs are in a different league...

Look a real Concert Grand, Rhodes, Wurlitzer.., also provides only one sound and we from KARO make this sounds available in highest quality for the O.

The EXs2 Piano is still good, but it is sounded totaly different from our piano libraries.

Some of the users can create their own version and maybe erase samples or vel. stages and combine it how they like... Why not!?

I have a lot of PMs at this forums and the people tell us.., we want a piano like the ivory... Now we still have it and we have more different piano models. For this authentic sounds you need the ram.

Maybe when Korg release an update with HD streaming, then you can load everything you want...

Best regards from greece,

KARO Sound Development
EWBR & medusaland

franzlp · Post by **franzlp** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:13 pm

It was previously stated...

Hi Kevin,
it is only my personal opinion, but many of the OASYS user I know are working with a seperate computer machine. One user who played the demos for us is using both KGP & KEP on stage now. I didnt hear any problems from him.
For me it is very clearly, if I want use the OASYS sounds for a setup or production I have two choices, I buy a second machine, or I will record the tracks in a external sequencer.

Although I love the sounds and the quality is excellent I must disagree with the statement. My thoughts are that if you create an add-on or componenet that works with a product such as the Oasys the aim should be that the product is self contained. Meaning, that the scope of how it works and the capabilitites it produces should not be depedent on use with external equipment. I think this is why the Oasys EX2 piano gets the accolade in the sense that you can use the outstanding piano effectively with the on -board sequecer and palette of other sounds. No one from Korg ever said that the idea was that you were likely to use an external sequecer and so forth. I guess users here are looking to a suite like was released by Karo that would work within function solely within the OAsys with no asterix. Again, I think it's a great product but folks do have a point that it has to "harmonize" with the rest of what the Oasys is. I should be able to take just the Oasys to a performance or recording without running into memory issue an having to shave off other EXis. If I am not correct on the way I've stated this please elaborate as we want to better understand.

Kevin Nolan · Post by **Kevin Nolan** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:34 pm

Hi KARO -

Thanks for your clarification and for your email to me; where you clarify matters exquisitely.

I see now that, with EXs2 removed, your pianos will be usable along side other sample packages - wonderful news and it totally resolves my genuine concern (where I have been spending over a year tuning my OASYS as a quite stand-alone production environment). So these pianos will work out very well in such scenarios and in a real time live environment - my order is already on its way to you - thanks most sincerely.

Franzlp - I fully accept your point and of course understand the no compromises approach of Karo. I don't think one scenario over rides the other hoever, my initial concerns were that using OASYS in standalone and live scenarios would not accomodate these pianos and other sample packages simultaneously, but I now see from KARO's explanation and email to me that I was wrong and that, with EXs2 removed (a completely reasonable compromise) that there's lots of sample room available for Karo and EXs3 libraries simultaneously. But I whole heartedly take your points on board - they are well made and are completely valid. I see now that we get the best of all worlds and its very exciting. (These releases and Stephen Kay's new wiki-based web site make for significant overall enhancement to OASYS - almost like a new release).

Cheers,
Kevin.

rkarlberg · Post by **rkarlberg** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:53 pm

Kevin Nolan wrote: ...how about offering a compressed samples version of each package for an extra add-on cost... This would be useful for live scenarios, especially for the KGP and KEP Keyboards, where fidelity is not critical, but where more pianos could be loaded into RAM simultaneously.

I think the problem here is with the Oasys itself. Clearly we need some new features in the next update. I really wish there was some way more RAM could be added. If not, we need some type of librarian to make it easier to create sets of sample that can be loaded/unloaded quickly and easily.

With regard to Karo pianos - it is what it is. I think they are designed to compete with Ivory - I just listened to the demos and they sound amazing. I found Ivory to be too much of a hassle; my only problem now is deciding which Karo pianos to buy.

Karo has done so much for us with all their libraries and programs; they have at least doubled the value of the Oasys in my opinion. The Oasys already has excellent pianos for most situations; now Karo has added some new choices for high quality sounds.

EWBR · Post by **EWBR** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:05 pm