Keyboards you are glad you sold

pranaearth · Post by **pranaearth** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:43 am

Motif ES6
01X
i88x
EMU XL7
Alesis QS 7.1
Peavey DPM 3

Try to program the Motif? I don't speak engineer. It was horrible for me. I also bought into that whole mLan fiasco.
Try as I might, I never seemed to get it working properly. And I tried on 2 desktops and 1 laptop. That kind of soured me on Yamaha for this lifetime.
The 01X is still sitting in a box somewhere around here. I couldn't even sell it, no one wanted it.

I never got the big fuss over Emu's stuff either. Yes, the filters are great, but they aren't sweepable, and the FX are mediocre at best.
That's another one siting in a box somewhere in my house.

The Alesis wasn't too too bad, but the music store that sold it to me was janky. No manual, open box, no bundled software. And no matter how many time I tried to get it from them, they never delivered on their promises to get it to me. SO I returned it.

The Peavey was a strange little synth. I had lots of problems with it. So, out it went.

Now I did sell my Wavestation out of dire financial need. That was the biggest mistake of my life. I should have carried that thing on my back on the way to the poorhouse.

I also had a Roland XP-60 that I loved more than life itself, but it fell during a move. So I sent it into Roland to fix. It took them 6 months to fix it, and when it finally got back to me, it wasn't fixed. So off to the trash it went. I think I may have cried.

Now I'm just saving my pennies to get me a Kronos.

shawnhar · Post by **shawnhar** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:14 pm

McHale wrote:Roland D-20. I sold it, a hardhell case, and a stand together for less than I could have sold the case for by itself. I wanted it out of my life THAT bad.

Really? As a former D5 owner (same as the D20, but without the FX or sequencer) I'm surprised to hear that.

I see a lot of disdain for the lower numbered D series synths, combined with respect for the original D50. But as far as I can tell, these were all basically the same synth hardware! Is there some significant difference I am missing, or do you dislike the D50 also?

EXer · Post by **EXer** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:03 pm

shawnhar wrote:I see a lot of disdain for the lower numbered D series synths, combined with respect for the original D50.

In fact, the "lower" D series are only loosely related to the D50. Their synth engine is a severely cut down version and their name was all about marketing. I could not explain it better than Gordon Reid in SOS, so let me quote:

LA Synthesis, the technology that powered the D50, not only sounded amazing — it made digital synthesis accessible again.

Roland capitalised upon the success and growing reputation of LA Synthesis and, later in the year, the MT32 appeared. Designed for home use alongside an electric piano or MIDI home keyboard, this used a much more limited form of LA synthesis, and its sound was in no way comparable to the 'real thing'. Unfortunately, Roland were rather naughty with the MT32 and its successors, advertising them in an ambiguous way that implied that they contained the D50's synthesis engine. I think that this was a significant mistake, and it may have backfired badly. If you had heard an MT32 in 1987 and thought that this was the sound of Roland's flagship synth, you would have wondered what all the fuss was about.
[...]
The same synthesis architecture lay at the heart of the D10 and D20 synths, and their rackmount equivalent, the D110. Again, these employed the limited LA synthesis pioneered by the MT32 so, in comparison to the D50, they sounded uniformly uninspiring.

Synthoid · Post by **Synthoid** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:19 pm

pranaearth wrote:Try to program the Motif? I don't speak engineer. It was horrible for me.

I have a Motif XS that is an improvement over the ES, especially with the large color screen, but it's still a chore to program. Yamaha is way behind Korg when it comes to operating systems and ease of use.

pranaearth wrote:I never got the big fuss over Emu's stuff either. Yes, the filters are great, but they aren't sweepable, and the FX are mediocre at best.

EMU didn't impress me either. I have a Vintage Pro rack synth. It's got some interesting sounds, but they all seem somewhat thin and bland to me. It's about as much fun to program as any rack synth, so it sits in a bedroom upstairs, unused. Maybe someday I'll set it up again in the studio.

shawnhar · Post by **shawnhar** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:19 pm

EXer wrote:In fact, the "lower" D series are only loosely related to the D50. Their synth engine is a severely cut down version and their name was all about marketing.

Do you know what the differences are?

I've never played a D50, but from reading about them online, the synth parameters and waveform names seem pretty much the same as I remember from my D5 (although that was many years ago so I could be misremembering).

I was always under the impression that they were the same synth engine, just maybe with lower quality electronics in the cheaper versions. Would be fascinated to learn more about what extra things the D50 could do!

bah · Post by **bah** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:20 pm

danmusician wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
danmusician wrote: My experience was similar, except that I thought the 01/W had warmth that the Trinity and Triton lacked.
Interesting to see that some people like the 01/W more than Trinity and others vice versa.
When I finally went to buy a replacement after using the 01/W for around 8 years, I just couldn't get behind the sound of the Korgs at the time. They just didn't sound as good to me. I couldn't figure out why and thought I was a lone nut. In recent years, I've read explanations regarding the difference in the technology and found that there were many others who held my view.

Clearly, not everyone hears it the same way.

Zeroesque · Post by **Zeroesque** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:42 pm

danmusician wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
danmusician wrote: My experience was similar, except that I thought the 01/W had warmth that the Trinity and Triton lacked.
Interesting to see that some people like the 01/W more than Trinity and others vice versa.
When I finally went to buy a replacement after using the 01/W for around 8 years, I just couldn't get behind the sound of the Korgs at the time. They just didn't sound as good to me. I couldn't figure out why and thought I was a lone nut. In recent years, I've read explanations regarding the difference in the technology and found that there were many others who held my view.

Clearly, not everyone hears it the same way.

Yes, not everyone likes the same flavors. I lusted after the 01/W when I was getting into pro synths, but the Trinity, to me, absolutely smokes it with filters and effects alone. The synth patch possibilites are simply on a whole different level. Were you really into the waveshaping feature or something, or thought the acoustic sounds had more realism?

EXer · Post by **EXer** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:56 pm

shawnhar wrote:Do you know what the differences are?

The engines are similar but not quite identical. Some information here (link). And the better effects of the D50 play a very important role in blending the partials of a tone and in blurring the transition between the partial used for the attack part of the sound and the partial used for the sustained part.

McHale · Post by **McHale** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:28 am

shawnhar wrote:
McHale wrote:Roland D-20. I sold it, a hardhell case, and a stand together for less than I could have sold the case for by itself. I wanted it out of my life THAT bad.
Really? As a former D5 owner (same as the D20, but without the FX or sequencer) I'm surprised to hear that.

I see a lot of disdain for the lower numbered D series synths, combined with respect for the original D50. But as far as I can tell, these were all basically the same synth hardware! Is there some significant difference I am missing, or do you dislike the D50 also?

EXer explained it pretty well.

But I loved the D50, despite how complicated it was to program. I bought the D20 thinking it was a D50 with a sequencer. At the time, it sounded OK and the drums were fairly decent. To listen to it today, I'd take a Wal-Mart Casio any day of the week over a D10, D20, or D110.

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:33 am

kimu wtf were you on when you sold that gear? WERE YOU ON DRUGS?
seriously, THAT IS SOME OF THE BEST GEAR IN SYNTH WORLD THAT YOU COULD GET YOUR GRITTY HANDS ON. WHY ON EARTH WOULD YOU SELL IT? THERE ISNT VERY MANY SYNTHS BETTER THAN THE ONES YOU GOT.

ALSO, WHY ON EARTH WOULD ANYONE SELL THE KORG POLY 800? THAT IS A CLASSIC EPIC SYNTH, IT CREATES REALLY REALLY GOOD SOUNDS.

as for everyone else, i'm not suprised you sold those things they are toyish and plastic, good riddance lol. especially when it comes to that terrible motif. yamaha motif is awful compared to some of the new stuff coming in.

Sina172 · Post by **Sina172** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:55 am

Vlad_77 · Post by **Vlad_77** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:07 am

Sina172 wrote:There's only ONE I am SO GLAD I got rid of:

The V-Synth GT! I had 4 of them and sold them after 3 months of pulling my hair out in anger because of that f*cking 28-Voice Limitation!!! Even when I tried to stack them, I was STILL losing polyphony!!!

A 28-Voice in 2010 has NO PLACE in this day and age!!!

I LOVE my Original V-Synths and XT's and will NEVER sell them, but the GT with TWO V-Synth Engines and a 4-Voice "increase" is FAR worse than the Fantom-G limitations in Sequencing and lack of support!

Thank GOD that GT is out of my life!

Sina

Wow pretty strong words Sina! I guess I don't get your assertion about there being no place for a 28 voice in 2010. I would LOVE a V-Synth in ANY flavor, and as far as polyphony goes, I would consider a V-Synth as a means of providing trippy tone colors that would be almost impossible to do on other synths.

I have to tell you that I STILL get inspiration from the limited polyphony of Radias, SH-32, Juno-106, JP-8000, Wavestation EX, and TG-33.

But your word are certainly valid for your music needs so I am not flaming. I just have NEVER read such a strong opinion AGAINST the V-Synth GT.

Ahimsa,
Vlad

PS: Just curious, if you HATED the GT, why did you buy four?

Sina172 · Post by **Sina172** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:45 am

MarPabl · Post by **MarPabl** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:17 am

Synthoid wrote:
pranaearth wrote:Try to program the Motif? I don't speak engineer. It was horrible for me.
I have a Motif XS that is an improvement over the ES, especially with the large color screen, but it's still a chore to program. Yamaha is way behind Korg when it comes to operating systems and ease of use.

I have the Motif XF and while AWM2 is actually simpler than EDS and HD-1, the user interface of Yamaha is not as good as Korg.

If you get to learn Motif's way of programing, it's not that hard but the issue is that the reference is sometimes hard to understand... You'll have to spend some time to learn but definitely the experience with Korg really helps a lot.

Anyways, I appreciate the Motif XF which is, by the way, my first Yamaha workstation.

I was very glad when I sold my Roland XP10 and changed it for a Korg Triton LE. Then I was happy to sell it and then get the Korg M3

sani · Post by **sani** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:59 am

1. Roland D5
2. Roland XP80
3. Motif ES6

Reason:
1.
I bought it as my second keyboard in my live rig in the early nineties. The D50 was still considered as a great second keyboard. The D5 sounded nowhere near as good as the D50.
2.
The xp80 was my first try to replace my Korg workstation as my main axe in my live rig. What a mistake. That keyboard had only 32 rewritable performances. At a time where Korg offered 256. I sold it after a year and swear never to buy Roland keyboards again. (I changed my mind later).
3.
The Motif ES is a great sounding keyboard. No question. But again, with some horrible limitations for those who play live. At least for me: performances limited to just 4 parts, all on the same midi channel, tedious workarounds for more parts by using song mode, pattern mode, master mode. No possibility to switch the polarity of my switch pedals in the os, no tap tempo to adjust the arpeggios or tempo based effects, no graphical representation of the amp and filter envelopes! I changed it for a Triton Pro X with the piano and studio exb.