new PA3x vs old PA3x = the winner is ....

T3X · Post by **T3X** » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:15 pm

karmathanever wrote:These are not stereo = they are balanced (TRS)

This is when I got confused, Pete. Is there any difference between balanced TRS plug and stereo TRS plug? I can see they look the same though.

I'm using mono TRS (unbalanced TRS?) and there is still a subtle hiss if I turn speaker volumes to really high. You won't hear it unless you stand a couple feet near the speakes. But I will get balanced cables if they eliminate this.

Marcus2222 · Post by **Marcus2222** » Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:17 am

karmathanever wrote: Are you using balanced cables?

The difference can be significant.
Pete

Hi Pete,

Can you tell me the actual technological difference between "balanced" cables and standard 1/4" to 1/4 "?

How does each route the signal? etc

I've only ever used 1/4" myself, but I'm always looking to improve.

karmathanever · Post by **karmathanever** » Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:12 pm

A TRS Cable is unique in that it can carry either a balanced audio signal or an unbalanced stereo signal. So when the common question, “Are TRS cables balanced?” arises, the answer seems somewhat vague: “They can be.”

Whether a TRS cable is balanced or not depends on what it is connecting. If the cable is between a balanced TRS output and a balanced TRS input, then the cable will carry a balanced signal, as well.

The reason for this is that a TRS cable can carry two audio signals, which gives it the ability to transfer both balanced and stereo audio. When it serves as a balanced audio signal, it is carrying two version of one signal (the normal signal and its inverted form). The input device then combines these two signals, creating one “noiseless” signal, meaning unwanted interference and noise is eliminated from the original audio signal.

On the other hand, when the TRS carries a stereo audio, it is taking the left and right audio signals from the output to the input – and the two signals will remain separate, thus staying in true stereo. A great example of this TRS stereo output is on headphones, which is why you get left audio signal in your left ear and the right in your right ear.

One thing to remember is that the stereo signal will be unbalanced in a TRS cord, as opposed to the balanced mono signal it can carry.

Hope this helps..

Pete

T3X · Post by **T3X** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:30 am

Thanks Pete. I'm not completely clear but never mind.

karmathanever · Post by **karmathanever** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:51 am

If you are going to use these for "balanced" audio, make sure you get good quality cables

You can use this cable for stereo connection - i.e. one cable plugged into stereo port (hi-fi amp etc...)
Or you can use it as a balanced cable in which case you need one for each audio (PA3X L or R or 1 or 2)
The devices you are connecting with balanced cables must be built/capable of utilising balanced cables (e.g. PA3X)

T3X · Post by **T3X** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:13 am

Now I see the different between 'balanced' or 'stereo'. Basically, if you use a stereo TRS cable in a mono connection then it becomes 'balanced' cable.

Thanks Pete

T3X · Post by **T3X** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:27 am

Marcus2222 wrote:
karmathanever wrote: Are you using balanced cables?

The difference can be significant.
Pete
Hi Pete,

Can you tell me the actual technological difference between "balanced" cables and standard 1/4" to 1/4 "?

How does each route the signal? etc

I've only ever used 1/4" myself, but I'm always looking to improve.

As I understand, in a Left and Right connection, if you use 2 stereo (or balanced) cables instead of 2 mono cables , you get better noise cancellation if any. Even though, in both case you get the same stereo output signal.

Thoraldus · Post by **Thoraldus** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:03 pm

Here is a relatively concise video on the difference between balanced and unbalanced lines.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jo5HhfIUSP0

Here's another good one complete with physical models and oscilloscope.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v31-qORXPY

Asena · Post by **Asena** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 4:37 pm

I Opened this Topic, And now i see all the topic changed to Balanced unbalanced cab els.

OK, Please Open the 3 X and open Volume to max, And than turn the 3x of when it,s plugged to mixer, And listen.

BUB sound is there, We all know that.

I heave 2 PA3X in the same Mixer, Old one POPS, The newer one is very god cause the newer is better electrical parts i think.

T3X · Post by **T3X** » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:23 pm

Asena wrote:I Opened this Topic, And now i see all the topic changed to Balanced unbalanced cab els.

OK, Please Open the 3 X and open Volume to max, And than turn the 3x of when it,s plugged to mixer, And listen.

BUB sound is there, We all know that.

I heave 2 PA3X in the same Mixer, Old one POPS, The newer one is very god cause the newer is better electrical parts i think.

Sorry to mess up your thread.

Not that I don't believe you, I only tried to identify any possible problem.

Anyway, I bought a pair of balanced cables and tried them out. They do work better. This may not help your old 3X but it is something we should all be aware of.

Bachus · Post by **Bachus** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 10:51 am

We used to make all our cables by ourselves to save some money... But the after a night of playing with the band and lots of beer, the solder never could withstand our cables... And yes, i really know how to solder the cables as i am an electronics engineer..

Oh man, i have seen so many broken cables its not funny anymore

Modern cables are mostly not soldered anymore but connected with shrinking tools... Which makes them much more reliable as the solder can not pick up any electronical signals that could lead to distortion...

The main difference between the 2 cables is that ballanced cables due to their nature are less prone to pick up distortion from other electronic equipment.

Nick G · Post by **Nick G** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:52 pm

I have had my PA3x 61 since they first got delivered to Australia... basically as soon as they were released i purchased it.

I have never noticed anything like you have stated especially the pop sound or the SHHHHH sound..

also the buttons are no different to any of the "newer" PA 3X's Ive seen in shops.

Cheers
Nick

John Kenevl · Post by **John Kenevl** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:56 am

Everyone Hello. The Korg pa3x have access SPDF - digital ? I want to figure in the receiver audio output and listen to him (sound) for large and qualitative columns B&W.