kimu wrote:if you don't mind not having arpeggiator and drum track keep the trinity.
i had a trinity V3 for 10 years and now own a M3 and have to say that:
- i am really happy with M3 because it opens new sonic possibilities for me with karma, drum track and new IFX
- some sound (e.g. piano) has been greatly improved in M3
- some sounds were much more better (more fat, more cutting in the mix, sounding better in live) in my trinity (e.g. some strings sounds, some lead sounds and MOSS sounds are not replicated with EXB-RADIAS)
All very true. But EXB-RADIAS and Radias as such weren't built to be Z1/MOSS replacements from the very beginning so, no wonder there, right?
I have to say, I've been spending hours and hours working on some sounds for my CD and - I've been abusing EXB-RADIAS and Z1 extensively. These two are just awesome. While I don't particularly like M3's sounds in many cases (but that's normal, having OASYS sitting next to it), both of these (M3 with EXB-RADIAS and Z1) sound just... superb. And completely different in character. I could go out on a limb here and say that they compliment each other extremely well.
Since the Trinity Korg has been very consistent with the structure of their differnts engines and GUI allowing an easy learning curve for the korg users that updated from old korg gear to new... that's a big difference with Roland and Yamaha and I strongly appreciate that.
Also the engine structure always seems to take the whole capabilities of the old synth and add new ones, except for the 8 IFX of the Tritiny, but the FX processor its a different story with a different kind of upgrade.
About the "fatness"... this is personal taste.. IMO, the sound is never outdated, u like it or not like it, that's all.
Take the Mellotron strings.. they are still used (on old mellotrons and VST emulation or samples on new boards), specially on studio, not for be the best strings, just becoz the composer like it.
I love the trinity so much, i think no other work station comes close, the trinity with the prophecy board or moss is simply the best work station ever made. I really wish i had the full keyboard again.
and so say people about their beloved fantom / motif / kurzweil / jd990... who is right here?
its just personal preference
my personal take on this is: while the M3 soundset is not my favorite ever (this has to be the fantom x´s for me) it is far from bad sounding and it´s my favorite workstation nevertheless and i love it for that. it´s not just a ROMpler and while i like a well done prefabricated soundset, i find it much more interesting to use your own sounds created from the included or own sampled waveforms and the M3 is great for that!
have only heard one factory demo of the tr-rack and it sounded GREAT!!! (as long as no realistic instruments were involved )
but saying the M3 sucks just because you don´t like its presets?
i personally don´t like the library that comes with Kontakt 3 (in fact, i havent even installed that library) but is still in my opinion one of the most incredible software instrument ever created
Hexfix93 wrote:M3 sucks, fx are nothing special, the sounds are clinical like a PC, not in your face at all, lack any kind of color. Its way to clean and annoying.
I think it comes down to what you want to use it for. The 'clean' sound works a lot better on modern tracks in the studio. Purely as a 'workstation', it is excelent because it sounds very close to using the actual instrument (especially the 'electric' - note not 'electronic' - sounds). It is very truthful.
It is just that many people have become used to synths being very un-real. I listened to the Trinity demo tracks. A real brass section does not sound anything like that. Does not mean that the trinity's brass section doesn't sound any good, but the ones on the newer workstations sound a lot more realistic. It is just like when the facebook layout changes, or when a new version of windows is released - it is more logical, especially if you've never used it before. but the problem is that most people have used it before - and they don't know where everything is, they don't like the new look. 'clean and uncoloured' isn't associated with 'good', despite the fact that it fits the original concept of a 'workstation' better.
as I said, it depends what you want - a 'workstation' that actually immitates instruments well, or just something that produces more interesting, fatter, less realistic sounds. The idea of a workstation imparting too much 'colour' on a sound kind of goes against the concept, its just that it wasn't really possible until recently.
I'd also like to point out that I can get a fair amount of 'dirt' out of my Radias. The thing I like about it though is i'm not stuck with that sound. I can use the open high sound it has in the first place, and start from there. People complained that the MS2000 was 'warmer' and more 'analog', but I think I can get the same sounds that I had on my microKorg, more or less, it just takes more programming because it isn't that way straight from an initialised patch - I have the choice to make it that way rather than having to always have a 'fat, analog, warm sound'.
sorry for editing a lot more into this. A few points came to me afer submitting.
Last edited by X-Trade on Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:21 am, edited 2 times in total.
Current Gear: Kronos 61, RADIAS-R, Volca Bass, ESX-1, microKorg, MS2000B, R3, Kaossilator Pro +, MiniKP, AX3000B, nanoKontrol, nanoPad MK II,
Other Mfgrs: Moog Sub37, Roland Boutique JX03, Novation MiniNova, Akai APC40, MOTU MIDI TimePiece 2, ART Pro VLA, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40.
Past Gear: Korg Karma, TR61, Poly800, EA-1, ER-1, ES-1, Kawai K1, Novation ReMote37SL, Boss GT-6B
Software: NI Komplete 10 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, Ableton Live 9. Apple OSX El Capitan on 15" MacBook Pro
Hexfix93 wrote:M3 sucks, fx are nothing special, the sounds are clinical like a PC, not in your face at all, lack any kind of color. Its way to clean and annoying.
my trinity racks have color, and can sound really dirty and the verbs are better.
I love the trinity so much, i think no other work station comes close, the trinity with the prophecy board or moss is simply the best work station ever made. I really wish i had the full keyboard again.
M3 = EPIC FAIL. Functions over Sound Quality and personality.
Its made to make super clean elevator music. It's awful.
k so what exactly are you trying to accomplish here? cause you're not going to get the people who frequent this forum to agree with you on your opinion of the M3... i'm very sorry it's not your cup of tea, but now you're just trolling different threads here trash-talking the equipment that a lot of us love using every day. I've been able to write some pretty amazing music with the M3, and I can tell you, i've never been so inspired by previous workstations. If there's something you need help with, a question you have about how to do something with the M3... by all means, ask away, but your posts are getting to be insulting. go take your M3-hate to the trinity forums
Hexfix93 wrote:M3 sucks, fx are nothing special, the sounds are clinical like a PC, not in your face at all, lack any kind of color. Its way to clean and annoying.
my trinity racks have color, and can sound really dirty and the verbs are better.
I love the trinity so much, i think no other work station comes close, the trinity with the prophecy board or moss is simply the best work station ever made. I really wish i had the full keyboard again.
M3 = EPIC FAIL. Functions over Sound Quality and personality.
Its made to make super clean elevator music. It's awful.
You are so damn wrong.
M3 effects are the best sinc Trinity. Especially Leslie simulation is MUCH better. Trinity reverbs better than M3? I laugh IN YOUR FACE, man, in your face.
Also if you remember correctly any DECENT effect on Trinity costed at LEAST 2 FX slots, which left you back to 4 slots. Sorry, but Triton and M3 are much better on that field.
Don't even get me started on Trinity's polyphony, it's laughable.
I agree MOSS was and still is amazing, I don't argue anything there. But Radias is very good as well, and it's not meant to be a substitution for MOSS! If you think that it is, then you're plain stupid.
If you can't make M3 sound dirty, then you don't know to program sounds well, that's all I'm gonna say. It doesn't have to be clean, you know. You have a very capable synthesis onboard M3, you need to learn to use it.
All your whining here is beyond any purpose. Trinity was a very good board. It is now obsolete. It has its own sound, true, but to me, there are better things down the road.
Also, what did you mean "clinical like a PC"?! Dude, software samplers sound BETTER THAN ANY KEYBOARD ON THE MARKET, because they have access to much greater amount of samples on hard drive. You're really utterly and completely wrong with that argument.
Hexfix93 wrote:M3 sucks, fx are nothing special, the sounds are clinical like a PC, not in your face at all, lack any kind of color. Its way to clean and annoying.
Dude, DAWs DO NOT HAVE A SOUND! THEY ALL "SOUND" THE SAME!
And you're really starting to troll this board. Please die. If you're not willing to delve into the depths of the synthesis M3 offers, you're a very superficial person and a lazy ass. Synthesizers are NOT judged by its presets. To think so is idiocy.
so yes, this is why i don't like it, if you like church music, bad rap, bad r and b, elevator music, yes its a fantastic synth if you want it to sound clean, steril, static and boring
elevator music could also be made with an e-guitar or oldschool sampler: clean static boring or cheesiness depends more on the musicians behind a song than what equipment has been used.
Hexfix93 wrote:Messed with 2.0 in the store, not impressed. It sounds like a DAW.
It's not what I like.
Ok, EPIC FAIL for what I am after.
It's not crap for everyone, its just crap for what i want. Its more lifeless boring clinical sound. Boring, un-inspiring. TO ME. not to everyone, this is just my opinion, not fact.
If the sound set is your problem why wouldn't you sample your trinity rack and have it on the m3 or use the rack with the m3. you could sample that thing in like a couple days.
The functions on the m3 are crazy. I stopped using daws for everything but mixing and i only use Eq and Compression during mixing because the Fx on the m3 are bomb. Particularly the guitar Fx, there's some grimey dirt for ya.
No, they sound exactly the same with the same settings (pan law, dithering, resampling algorithm, etc.) It has been proven countless times with null tests. Pro engineers who know their s**t approved it a long time ago.
It's all just summing 0s and 1s, they are the same. PCM playback algorithms have NOTHING to do with it, and especially with anything today when assembler is forgotten.
Once again - DAWs DO NOT HAVE "SOUND", THEY JUST SUM 0s AND 1s AND THAT'S IT!
You're a really ridiculous man, I'm having great laughs here
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