Filter Modulation by Assignable pedal (pa800)

chrisgr · Post by **chrisgr** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:55 am

Hello to all!
I have a question about assignable pedal.
In Sound mode,Filter section and Filter Mod. tab, when I choose Assing. Pedal at Filter A Modulation AMS1, nothing seems to happen when I push the pedal up or down.The same thing happens in every AMS.
If I select Joystick +Y and move the joystick, then I have filter modulation.In Global - Controllers - Pedal/Footswitch, if I choose Joystick +Y, then when I push the pedal I have filter modulation again.
What I want to do is to be able to control the sound volume and filter at the same time.If I choose Keyboard Expression or Off in Global setup, I can't control the filter.
Is there a way to make this happen?
I use the Korg EXP-2 pedal.
Thanks in advance!

WDMcM · Post by **WDMcM** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 4:13 pm

I am fairly certain that the Assignable pedal can only access a single parameter at a time, in other words you can't do what you are trying to do the way you are trying to do it. But it can be done with two pedals.

Since the Pa800 only has one continuous pedal input, you will need to use MIDI to accomplish the task. You will need a device that converts a continuous pedal signal to MIDI like the MIDI Solutions Pedal Controller and another EXP2 or similar CC pedal. Then program the pedal controller to transmit Y- or whatever you want to assign to Filter Mod and problem solved. Instead of using the MIDI Solutions/CC Pedal combo, you could get a Behringer FCB1010 or a Roland FC300. The nice thing with that idea is that these units have two CC pedals already attached and a number of footswitches that can be assigned start/stop, fills, variations, etc. I would go for the Behringer myself, and may just do that for use with my Pa588.

Best Regards,

Dave

chrisgr · Post by **chrisgr** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:11 pm

Thank you for the answer.
The thing is that I couldn't make it work even with no other parameter assigned to the pedal.Even if I set the Global - Controllers - Pedal/Footswitch to Off I see no result in Filter Modulation.
How could I do that?

BasariStudios · Post by **BasariStudios** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:54 pm

Filter Modulation is a Continous MIDI Controller/Message, thats why you
cant do it with a FS Pedal. WDM is right, you need to find something else.

WDMcM · Post by **WDMcM** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:12 pm

Sorry, from your original post is sounded like you could get the pedal to work but not to control the filter and volume at the same time;

In Global - Controllers - Pedal/Footswitch, if I choose Joystick +Y, then when I push the pedal I have filter modulation again.

What I want to do is to be able to control the sound volume and filter at the same time.

So are you saying that you can't make the EXP2 control the filter at all? If so I'll take a look at my Pa588 tomorrow and figure it out and post instructions. I have to get to a gig right now or I would do it today, sorry.

Best Regards,

Dave

WDMcM · Post by **WDMcM** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:15 pm

BasariStudios wrote:Filter Modulation is a Continous MIDI Controller/Message, thats why you
cant do it with a FS Pedal. WDM is right, you need to find something else.

Yes but he said that he is using an EXP2 pedal which is a Continuous Controller pedal.

Also, a footswitch should work as well except the value will not move smoothly and continuously throughout the range but instead go from 0 immediately to 127; so it will be full off or full on.

Best Regards,

Dave

chrisgr · Post by **chrisgr** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:04 pm

On the AMS list there is an option called Assign. pedal but it doesn't seem to work on my pa800.I wonder if it's only me who has this problem unless BasariStudios is right.But if Dave is right what is the problem?
Can anyone give it a try and see if it works?

karmathanever · Post by **karmathanever** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:04 am

I cannot comment on the EXP2 in the switch port but I have the Behringer FCB1010 MIDI pedal and it works fine.
For example, I used it for varying (NOT toggling) the speed of the Rotary effect.

Cheers

Pete

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 11:26 am

if it is anything like in the triton or M series or most other KORG keyboards, there is something that you can kind of consider an 'internal MIDI bus'.

The pedal is converted to something akin to whatever is internally interpreted to MIDI messages first before being picked up by AMS (as is every other controller on the keyboard/module).

so, if you set AMS source to assignable pedal, you also have to make sure that in global mode (and saved/written global changes, preferably), you've got the pedal set to 'assignable pedal' and not 'expression', or something else.

in one you are setting what the filter responds to, in the other you are setting what the pedal puts out into the system. so both have to match.
similarly, if you had the pedal set to 'expression', then you could set the filter AMS source to expression and it would still work. except expression automatically acts as a volume swell for the timbre too, so assignable pedal or another unused message type is best.

make sure you have set a sensible amount for the AMS modulation amount/coefficient too.

WDMcM · Post by **WDMcM** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 3:06 pm

I had a little time and was able to accomplish what you are trying to do; control filter and amplitude with a single CC pedal.

In global I assigned the pedal to -Y. I then selected a sound (I used a clav sound) and entered sound edit mode. I set the AMS to -Y with an intensity of 99 and lowered the filter cut-off frequency to 0. This allowed the filter cut-off value to be controlled by the pedal. I then went to the amplifier and set the AMS to -Y with an intensity of 50. Now when moving the pedal the volume increases/decreases and the filter also opens and closes at the same time.

I also tried assigning -Y to the filter LFO depth with an intensity of 99 which added and increase the LFO modulation to the filter.

So I'm not sure why you are having difficulties. If it would help, I will program a sound so that it responds to the assignable pedal to control volume and filter cut-off or LFO modulation and send it to you so you can have a look at the parameters. just let me know.

Best Regards,

Dave

chrisgr · Post by **chrisgr** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 4:48 pm

@X-Trade: I am not in front of the keyboards right now and I won't be until Wednesday but I believe the only options for assignable pedal in global setup are 'expression' and 'switch' but I am not completely sure.
The other thing is that there is not an 'expression' option on the AMS list.

@Dave: The way you are describing is quite the same with what I write in my first message.The problem is that if I do this I have to change every sound I use so it will work that way.That's the difficulty I'm having!

@karmathanever: Are you talking about pa800?Is the way you did it similar to the way WDMcM describes?

If it's the pedal's fault, which pedal should I buy to do this?
I'd prefer a single pedal.
Thank you all guys for your answers and for your time!

chrisgr · Post by **chrisgr** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:52 am

chrisgr wrote:@X-Trade: I am not in front of the keyboards right now and I won't be until Wednesday but I believe the only options for assignable pedal in global setup are 'expression' and 'switch' but I am not completely sure.
The other thing is that there is not an 'expression' option on the AMS list.

I'm sorry for the mistake I made and I don't know what I was thinking!
There are many options for the pedal at the global setup but it's true that there is no expression option on the AMS list.

I just want to find out how the option 'Assign.pedal' on the AMS list works and what does it do...

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 3:54 pm

chrisgr wrote: I just want to find out how the option 'Assign.pedal' on the AMS list works and what does it do...

quite simple - it is a source for a CC, which happens to often be used in KORG keyboards for the assignable expression pedal.

if you have an expression pedal in the assignable pedal slot, and have it set to 'assignable pedal' in global mode, then it will give you that pedal as a modulation source.

but if you set it to something else in global mode, assuming that is also available as a modulation source, it will still work under that AMS source instead. as long as the two are equal. obviously if you are using it as an expression or control pedal then it makes sense to leave it set to 'assignable pedal'.