Kaossilator Pro - the Pro is a joke!

[Mr36]

It's nothing personal.

I do not work for Korg. If I did and had any say, many of these problems of which you speak would not exist because the units would have been tested by real people first.
I am debating with you (and others) about this because it seems that so many people don't mind complaining about what's wrong with it but seem to be blinded by everything that's right with it. Every device has some flaws.

And for £300/$400 you can get all that? Fair enough. But like I said in my previous post, it's a hell of a lot more to add to a live rig than just one box.

Don't get me wrong, I see the pros and cons for it but I think it's unfair to expect the world of pro-audio in one box for £300.

[salamanderanagram]

my computer was $500. barely more than one of these and vastly more capable. if you want to be serious about making *electronic* music, trying to do so without a computer, is frankly crazy IMO.

but even bringing that to the table is like me pointing out how useless a kpro is without a mixer and a pair of speakers....

In fact, I'll hardly use the presets and use other things for the sounds but the fact that I don't need to set up a laptop to play live is priceless.

so... you're going to use it as a looper only? there's certainly something better out there in that case...

[curtaineater]

one positive with the k-pro is that my girlfriend loves it. i think that is awesome because it opens up a huge market. some people like to make music but they suck at it. this kind of holds your hand if you want it to.

[Mr36]

Although this is now getting a bit petty, which most certainly was not my intention, you need speakers for a computer set up too...

You stress the word 'electronic' in electronic music as if it is synonymous with computer. Making electronic music without electricity is crazy. Making electronic music without a computer is just making electronic music without a computer. It's just a different approach. I do it and have done it for years. As, I'm sure, have many others.

Not to say that computers don't make it a lot easier. They do. But I don't think the KPro was created to spar with the likes of Ableton Live users. That would be crazy.

[salamanderanagram]

i never said they were synonymous, i said making purely electronic music without a computer is crazy IN MY OPINION. sure, it can, and has been done. however, these days an insanely powerful computer can be had for $500-600. there's no other gear that costs that little and has even half of the capacities of a computer. it can easily replace several thousands worth of gear.

also, i don't need external speakers to write music. often i just use the ones that are built in.

[Mr36]

I am not disputing the power of computers. But they are not a hardware-only solution to creating live electronic music.

[samartin]

If you are a pro why are you interested in the KPro? I see the KPro as the next step to the so-called toy Kaossilator. Don't you have a keyboard already? Wouldn't it make sense to use a dedicated looper such as the KP3? This isn't directed at anyone, but these are the questions I would ask myself.

I might be off the mark as I'm not a muso, but I do work in 3D, and I assess the tools out there on practicality, do I need particles, no, do I need CA, yes, but can alternative tool do this, yes. Goes on and on, it just boils down to learning the quirks, avoiding them and at the end of the day it is just a tool.

As for the KPro, I do think it was intended for the beginner, I can't play jack on a keyboard, but the KPro does away with understanding chords (how to play them that is).

On the flipside, someone like Denkitribe is clearly a pro, maybe he's a little irked at the KPro, but he has adapted and got around certain issues!

[Mr36]

Don't start the KPro vs. KP3 debate again!
And anyway, it's not really a "dedicated looper". It just can do that but without overdubs.

It does come down to what you want to get out of it. I, personally, wanted something that I could play anything into, loop, overdub, split up to more than one part, and play something else live without having to use a computer. As far as I know this is the only non-computer device suitable to do that.

[samartin]

Didn't realise the vs. was a contentious point! But I like it already

What did you mean by "splitting up more than one part", going from one genre to another?

[Mr36]

It could be used for that but no, I just meant it in the sense of having more than one track, which on the KPro comes in the form of the four loop banks. I didn't just want a looper that only had one, so the majority of guitarist-friendly loopers were out.

[bluemind]

I see this device mostly as an idea creating tool with good sounds build in. The fact that you can power it on and have a groove going on in about a minute or so is very important aspect to this device. And if you have something you like, then you can export the loops to a daw, arrange them and keep them if they fit or use as placeholders and build your song up from there and replace elements as you will, maybe even record some more KOPro in top of it.

Hardware design is expensive and time consuming. It's not a fair comparison to compare the KOPro to a computer and say "just double the memory, it's cheap", because it's a different world altogether.

That said, if it is possible to correct some of these issues that are mentioned, I would appreciate if Korg took the time and made firmware updates, that's only fair to the customers.

But I'm happy with my KOPro the way it is

[Radian]

I'm glad to see a broad range of attitudes emerging in this debate. However there is still a very unusual 500lb Gorilla in the room that can't be ignored: The 2010 KPRO appears to have been produced as a 100% re-use of a 2006 hardware design that was probably specified a good bit earlier than that. I really don't want to open it up and check but the slow USB, <=2GB SD reader and modest memory resources strongly support this assumption.

I knew the chassis and controls were going to be the same when I bought it, and I knew this would probably lead to some compromises in usability, but I was really hoping there'd be a different PCB carrying contemporary electronic resources replacing those mentioned above. These appear to be the source of the most serious disappointments and is, in my recollection, an unprecedented product development strategy undertaken by a major manufacturer. Their motivation can only be guessed at but I sincerely hope some of the money saved will be allocated to future firmware enhancements aimed at providing more features (product value for money) and refining the user interface in the light of sensible customer feedback.

Having set out the criticisms its only fair to give praise to the areas that I think shine: The Kaossilator concept is truly wonderful. It can't be described as totally unique, but it's very close to being that. As a standalone music creation station providing immediate results with hardly a hint of complication, it's in a league of its own. Anyone prepared to make comparisons with computer software alternatives ought probably to stick with that approach as their value system is totally different.

[k0va5]

Having set out the criticisms its only fair to give praise to the areas that I think shine: The Kaossilator concept is truly wonderful. It can't be described as totally unique, but it's very close to being that. As a standalone music creation station providing immediate results with hardly a hint of complication, it's in a league of its own. Anyone prepared to make comparisons with computer software alternatives ought probably to stick with that approach as their value system is totally different.

agreed

[Mr36]

Agreed also.

[curtaineater]

ditto.