GENESIS SOUNDS

JONLIBRA · Post by **JONLIBRA** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:26 pm

Hi everyone!

I´m joining a local Genesis tribute band. Of course, learning Tony´s parts is taking most of my time so I can´t deal with sounds right now...and being honest I´m not very good at editing...

I´ve found some great programs/combis in the download section, but do you know about some other resource that could help me?
By the way, thank you very much to BW, STESCO, KORGMAN, KIKE, and many others for their patches!!!

J

BillW · Post by **BillW** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:43 pm

Good luck with those parts! You are fortunate to find a group of musicians willing to put a Genesis tribute together. My prog band has been looking for a guitarist for more than 5 years.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:50 am

Ok. Lets do this. Let me send you my old backup from 2011, which contained my most recent iteration of combis. ALthough, they are all designed to be played with 3 keyboards. Just like Tony in LOE. I have a Wavestation for leads, a Roland A33 controller with weighted keys for organs and pianos (below the WS) and I used to have my M50 at the left. I really didn't used the M50 keybed much, just like Tony hardly used the OASYS keyboard. Although, all sounds come from it. Just like in my setup.

I strongly recommend you think about it. There is a reason why Tony uses all those surfaces, and is to avoid switching patches in the middle of the song.

Let me put an example:

In The Cage:

Combi 1: In The Cage - Start

Surfaces:
M50 (Krome): Waiving phased intro sound split with strings.
Roland: Hammond with left 2 drawbars full, mid drawbar half way, everything else up (silent) and full percussion. Very slow vibrato. Better to use Chorus effect.
Wavestation: Main Lead (Sawtooth + Koto) with a bit of portamento.

Play mode
You begin with a phaser like waiving sound. I put that on the left split of the M50, since I don't need to reach back to it once I stop using it. I use the right split for the strings, which will came into play a couple of times during the main organ chord part.

On the lead part, I use the WS and the left bass organ from the same hammond patch.

Before the Cinema Show solo, I switch combi. Just like Tony does (he uses a switchbox mounted on the WS). There is plenty of time to switch.

Combi 2: Cinema Show Solo

Surfaces:
M50: Hammond organ with full drawbars layered to mellotron like choir.
Roland: Full organ as before, no choir. I thin Tony is using a pedal for the choirs, though, since they come a go at times. I don't do it that way, I simply switch from playing on the Roland to the M50 if I want strings and organ together.
Wavestation: Main lead (sawtooth) with portamento. No Koto layer. I use two sawtooth layered and detune them a tiny bit to opposite sides, giving them more thickness.

Play mode
I use this combi almost all the way to the end, since I play the 3 sides live version, which features Colony of Slippermen part, instead of Duke travels.

Combi 3: Slippermen + Afterglow

Surfaces:
M50: Nothing
Roland: Left split, a Hammond organ. Try to look one that you like. Right split, Mellotron Choir.
Wavestation: Slippermen Lead, which is similar to the previous lead, only more portamento.

Play mode
I simply use this setup all the way passing to Afterglow, on which I end up playing with the Roland surface only, organ on the left, choirs on the right.

The end.

TIPS:
- Learn how to program your M50. Is imperative you know how to do it. It will take time, but is worth it, and will end up being a lot of fun. I'm giving you a huge head start with this.
- You'll need a MIDI device to hook two keyboards at once to the M50. I use a MOTO micro express (old version), but you can find others that you like, or fit your wallet.
- If you only want to use 2 boards, it can be done, but you'll be very tight. I had the M50 61. I guess the 73 or 88 might be better to get more real state.

That's it for now. I'll keep posting tips here.

My combis right now are: (tested and played):

- Fading Lights ( I use the Wavestation internal sounds for this, so I guess you'll have to look out for the sounds. I have a program I did for the minilead, which is the main sound used here. You can start by using that one).
- Follow You Follow Me
- Firth of Fifth (3 combis)
- I know what I like
- Watcher of the Skies
- Dance on a Volcano / Los Endos
- In The Cage (5 combis). I changed to 3 combis now, but you can start with this one.

There are many more in the backup PCG, but mostly tests and some other stuff, like a few RUSH songs and DT's Erotomania screaming organ.

Now just PM me your Email and I'll send the file.

Hope it helps.

Keep asking, and I'll keep helping as much as I can.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:54 am

VEEEEERY VERY VERY...... VERY important. Not only to you, but to your band mates.

Rehearse and play the LIVE versions. They did all kinds of crazy stuff on studio, and you'll find a really hard time to come up with certain sounds. They simply recorded tracks, and mixed them together. Live, they can't do that, so the way they sound live, is the way you must play Genesis music.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 2:31 am

This old thread is also worth a read. I even did a whole document from this and other threads about Genesis sounds. I'll also send it out to you.

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... ht=#285882

JONLIBRA · Post by **JONLIBRA** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 2:54 pm

Thank you, BW. Yes, it seems hard to find us "crazy" musicians.

Thank you very much, mocando!!! Very interesting posts.

I´m also playing with 3 keyboards -M5O, SP250 controlling the M50, and Roland A33 at the left controlling an Emu Proteus 2000 with the B3 and Protozoa expansions-. But you are right, I'll need a MIDI device to hook two keyboards at once to the M50.

I´ll pm my email.

JONLIBRA · Post by **JONLIBRA** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 3:02 pm

Rehearse and play the LIVE versions. They did all kinds of crazy stuff on studio, and you'll find a really hard time to come up with certain sounds. They simply recorded tracks, and mixed them together. Live, they can't do that, so the way they sound live, is the way you must play Genesis music.

I agree with you. It´s the best way to go with Genesis.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Sat Oct 06, 2012 6:02 am

This is the document I was talking you about: http://korgfans.wordpress.com/2012/10/0 ... is-sounds/

Ajbbklyn · Post by **Ajbbklyn** » Sat Oct 06, 2012 1:26 pm

Martin - the .PCG files on Korgfans - all of these are for the M50?

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Sat Oct 06, 2012 4:32 pm

Ajbbklyn wrote:Martin - the .PCG files on Korgfans - all of these are for the M50?

Yup. I'm rebuilding an old site of mine, and I will segregate the downloads by model, but so far is all M50 stuff.

Besides, there are a few PCGs from KorgForums members, that are also on the download section here.

csteen · Post by **csteen** » Sat Oct 06, 2012 5:09 pm

Thanks Mocando, I downloaded the whole batch and started messing around with some of them just this morning. There are a ton of patches all in one location and many of them are very good indeed. New M50 owners should definately take advantage of these files no doubt.

AEJOTZ · Post by **AEJOTZ** » Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:08 pm

Just the mere thought of the opening keyboards of Watcher of the Skies gives me goosebumps.

I gotta love a forum that appreciates Mr. Anthony George Banks.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:03 am

AEJOTZ wrote:Just the mere thought of the opening keyboards of Watcher of the Skies gives me goosebumps.

I gotta love a forum that appreciates Mr. Anthony George Banks.

Cool. I'll shoot a short video of my version soon. I still need to figure out the mixture of mellotron sounds that Tony used. So far I heard it used the 3 violins + brass and a tiny bit of accordeon, but I haven't found a close match in my tests.

If anyone have any ideas, I'll be really grateful.

3nglenn · Post by **3nglenn** » Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:47 pm

Hello all. Any suggestions on achieving a fuller mellotron sound (like Watcher of the Skies Live, Yes Heart of the Sunrise, Moody Blues Question, etc. etc.) The factory patch sounds rather dry, even on my Yamaha's too. Change of parimeter settings? (Yes I'm a noobie) Thanks for any and all suggestions. G.P.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:01 pm

3nglenn wrote:Hello all. Any suggestions on achieving a fuller mellotron sound (like Watcher of the Skies Live, Yes Heart of the Sunrise, Moody Blues Question, etc. etc.) The factory patch sounds rather dry, even on my Yamaha's too. Change of parimeter settings? (Yes I'm a noobie) Thanks for any and all suggestions. G.P.

The Watcher of the Skies sound is one of the most difficult patches that I've been trying to emulate. For my latest iteration, in a very crippled Casio workstation, I used samples from the real mellotrons. But still, as X-Trade once said to me, what you can't achieve with a modern synth or a sampler is "character".
Still it doesn't sound quite near the original sound, meaning that I have still not found the right mixture of sounds. I know there is a 3 violin sound, and some brass, but how he mixed them together, remains a mystery.

As I recommended above to the OP: Learn how to program your keyboard. It might seem like a steep learning curve at the beginning, but it will pay off in satisfaction and tons of fun.