Yamaha Sound Guy says-

MoonMusic · Post by **MoonMusic** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:59 am

"All of you who think buying a Kronos will be a step up on the ladder to
success might benefit more from working on your songwriting, arranging,
and audio production skills. " - DavePolich

Think he's upset? HA!

MoonMusic · Post by **MoonMusic** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:00 am

Double post

jemkeys25 · Post by **jemkeys25** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:07 am

you know the saying "it's not the instrument it's who's playing it"

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:26 am

Yes, and the same thing could be said for every Yamaha keyboard released in the last 10 years.

Busch.

Kevin Nolan · Post by **Kevin Nolan** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:31 am

The best violinists demand the best violins. The best pianists demand the best pianos (not Yamaha by the way). The best synthesists and contemporary players and composers demand the best keyboards - Korg at the moment.

If there is truth behind that Yamaha statement; I recommend that that Yamaha employee had better get the finger out. He doesn't have time to be envious of Korg or to knock the earnest musicians who'll buy the Kronos. He should already be busy saving his job - because if he's in the Motif team then his job is already on the line. Furthermore, he'd do better to learn his own company's legacy from the GX1, CS80, CP80, GS1, DX1&7, SY77&99 to the VL1; and realise that there was actually a time when people looked to Yamaha for the best contemporary instruments.

As a Yamaha fan and owner, it saddens me that Yamaha have done nothing since the EX5 but wallow in complacency and mediocrity. They have just had their butt whipped by Korg; and to repeat - I wouldn't be so smug if I were him, I'd start burning the midnight oil to design the next 'game changer' of real substance or he'll be withdrawing social welfare payments sooner than he can say "Motif screwed up my career in Yamaha"

Kevin.

macalister · Post by **macalister** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:50 am

MoonMusic wrote:"All of you who think buying a Kronos will be a step up on the ladder to
success might benefit more from working on your songwriting, arranging,
and audio production skills. " - DavePolich

Think he's upset? HA!

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/2011/01/ ... h-library/

apex · Post by **apex** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:05 am

Kevin Nolan wrote:The best violinists demand the best violins. The best pianists demand the best pianos (not Yamaha by the way). The best synthesists and contemporary players and composers demand the best keyboards - Korg at the moment.

If there is truth behind that Yamaha statement; I recommend that that Yamaha employee had better get the finger out. He doesn't have time to be envious of Korg or to knock the earnest musicians who'll buy the Kronos. He should already be busy saving his job - because if he's in the Motif team then his job is already on the line. Furthermore, he'd do better to learn his own company's legacy from the GX1, CS80, CP80, GS1, DX1&7, SY77&99 to the VL1; and realise that there was actually a time when people looked to Yamaha for the best contemporary instruments.

As a Yamaha fan and owner, it saddens me that Yamaha have done nothing since the EX5 but wallow in complacency and mediocrity. They have just had their butt whipped by Korg; and to repeat - I wouldn't be so smug if I were him, I'd start burning the midnight oil to design the next 'game changer' of real substance or he'll be withdrawing social welfare payments sooner than he can say "Motif screwed up my career in Yamaha"

Kevin.

kevin your statement is correct (except for the synthesis part)... but think about what the Beatles used to create the masterpieces that they have created.... and all the other oldies/but great.... there is a certain quality that comes with high quality acoustic instruments.... it's not exactly the same with synths....

he's just saying that the Kronos (just like any other instrument) doesn't automatically propel your skills.... we spend more time researching and reading about new technology vs REALLY learning our instruments.

apex · Post by **apex** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:09 am

Kevin Nolan wrote:The best violinists demand the best violins. The best pianists demand the best pianos (not Yamaha by the way). The best synthesists and contemporary players and composers demand the best keyboards - Korg at the moment.

If there is truth behind that Yamaha statement; I recommend that that Yamaha employee had better get the finger out. He doesn't have time to be envious of Korg or to knock the earnest musicians who'll buy the Kronos. He should already be busy saving his job - because if he's in the Motif team then his job is already on the line. Furthermore, he'd do better to learn his own company's legacy from the GX1, CS80, CP80, GS1, DX1&7, SY77&99 to the VL1; and realise that there was actually a time when people looked to Yamaha for the best contemporary instruments.

As a Yamaha fan and owner, it saddens me that Yamaha have done nothing since the EX5 but wallow in complacency and mediocrity. They have just had their butt whipped by Korg; and to repeat - I wouldn't be so smug if I were him, I'd start burning the midnight oil to design the next 'game changer' of real substance or he'll be withdrawing social welfare payments sooner than he can say "Motif screwed up my career in Yamaha"

Kevin.

in the VERY LARGE scope of things... there is not alot more that you can do with the KRONOS that you couldn't do most of the other synths in some way or another.

i mean think about it.... can you really produce better with the Kronos than you will be able to with the M3? XS, Fantom.... etc....

I mean there are some things that are improved, but at the end of the day, you could probably get the job done with any of the above mentioned instruments....

jemkeys25 · Post by **jemkeys25** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:35 am

for me its not about making myself better, my boards are my tools for working, paying, gigs. unlike a lot of instruments that I read about that sit in smoke free studios for years,my boards are always gigging,dropped,knocked over, liquid spilled on them, smoke,dust, screws coming loose, scratches, broken end pieces,you name it,they get beat to heck. so evetually they get replaced. now i have a kurzweil k2661 thats in just the condition i've described after six or seven years of being dragged to gigs, and its doing funky things on gigs,so its time to replace. when i replace it,i'm not going to replace it with another k2661,no, i'll upgrade to the pc3k6,which i need for the sampling ram,unfortunatly they haven't released it yet. same with my m3, when i replace it, i'll replace it with kronos, not another m3.

apex · Post by **apex** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:30 am

jemkeys25 wrote:for me its not about making myself better, my boards are my tools for working, paying, gigs. unlike a lot of instruments that I read about that sit in smoke free studios for years,my boards are always gigging,dropped,knocked over, liquid spilled on them, smoke,dust, screws coming loose, scratches, broken end pieces,you name it,they get beat to heck. so evetually they get replaced. now i have a kurzweil k2661 thats in just the condition i've described after six or seven years of being dragged to gigs, and its doing funky things on gigs,so its time to replace. when i replace it,i'm not going to replace it with another k2661,no, i'll upgrade to the pc3k6,which i need for the sampling ram,unfortunatly they haven't released it yet. same with my m3, when i replace it, i'll replace it with kronos, not another m3.

well that makes perfect sense... but probably not the same situation for every one else (MOST) of the other people that are considering the upgrade...

for most of us, it's not "time for an upgrade" it's just that we "want to upgrade".....

orpheus2006 · Post by **orpheus2006** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:07 am

MoonMusic wrote:"All of you who think buying a Kronos will be a step up on the ladder to
success might benefit more from working on your songwriting, arranging,
and audio production skills. " - DavePolich

Think he's upset? HA!

What a big mistake!
Dave just added fresh fuel to the fire that is burning at Yamaha.

ozy · Post by **ozy** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:17 am

If instruments didn't matter,

We'd all be singers, not players.

We want more sound than our body can produce because we want to relate to the external world,

We want polyphony because we want to "sing" for a community,

We want instruments.

Should they be bad?

Come on...

vEddY · Post by **vEddY** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:20 am

jemkeys25 wrote:for me its not about making myself better, my boards are my tools for working, paying, gigs. unlike a lot of instruments that I read about that sit in smoke free studios for years,my boards are always gigging,dropped,knocked over, liquid spilled on them, smoke,dust, screws coming loose, scratches, broken end pieces,you name it,they get beat to heck. so evetually they get replaced. now i have a kurzweil k2661 thats in just the condition i've described after six or seven years of being dragged to gigs, and its doing funky things on gigs,so its time to replace. when i replace it,i'm not going to replace it with another k2661,no, i'll upgrade to the pc3k6,which i need for the sampling ram,unfortunatly they haven't released it yet. same with my m3, when i replace it, i'll replace it with kronos, not another m3.

If you don't mind me intruding... I guess you're going down the nerve-wrecking and long, winding road of throwing money away by replacing stuff in such a manner. And I can honestly offer at least two ways of going "around" these problems and staying happy with your sound. Both would mean extensive soul-searching and quite a few changes, but I guess you'd save money in the long run.

1. Build a rack with a computer, run VST's and from time to time, replace the "master keyboard" which you're using to trigger sounds. It would probably take months to find all that you need, but in the end, long-term maintenance is much cheaper then going like you're going now. And computer parts are dirt-cheap as well.

2. Build a rack with rack versions of synths, leave them far away from liquids, smoke, fire, and all of the other stuff, buy some replacement parts so you can be sure, and from time to time, when you spill some beer on the - again - master keyboard you're using to trigger sounds - replace the master keyboard with a newer one. A lot of keyboards have their rack versions.

Both ways have pluses and minuses, and both are much versatile then having keyboards in front of you. In this day and age, growing number of musicians are doing this and are very happy with the work they've done.

Not trying to patronize here, honestly. Just pains me to see what you're going through.

orpheus2006 · Post by **orpheus2006** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:29 am

vEddY wrote:1. Build a rack with a computer, run VST's and from time to time, replace the "master keyboard" which you're using to trigger sounds. It would probably take months to find all that you need, but in the end, long-term maintenance is much cheaper then going like you're going now. And computer parts are dirt-cheap as well.

2. Build a rack with rack versions of synths, leave them far away from liquids, smoke, fire, and all of the other stuff, buy some replacement parts so you can be sure, and from time to time, when you spill some beer on the - again - master keyboard you're using to trigger sounds - replace the master keyboard with a newer one. A lot of keyboards have their rack versions.

Absolutely right, but it depends on your requirements.
I rather prefer making music than collecting, testing and maintaining an arsenal of Virtual Instruments and Samples, configuring complex DAW setups, and so forth. How much time do you spend for listening and rehearing sounds and choose the ones you like? I'm glad Korg and their professional musicians did this kind of work for me and sell it in a nice unit.

vEddY · Post by **vEddY** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:11 am

orpheus2006 wrote:Absolutely right, but it depends on your requirements.
I rather prefer making music than collecting, testing and maintaining an arsenal of Virtual Instruments and Samples, configuring complex DAW setups, and so forth. How much time do you spend for listening and rehearing sounds and choose the ones you like? I'm glad Korg and their professional musicians did this kind of work for me and sell it in a nice unit.

In my experience, the whole process looks a bit different then that. You lose a lot of time INITIALLY, not all the time. The same goes for a synth when you go to a store and buy it. If you gig a lot, you will definitely spend a whole lot of time programming it before you go and use it live. That "initial" time you "lose" with VSTi's is a bit more then what you'd need with a synth, I agree with that completely. But in the long run, the process remains pretty much the same and that "overhead" doesn't grow, it shrinks.

Also, trying out new software instruments is a fun thing to do in my book.

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