Disk mode cannot audition 48Khz wave files & no OS updat

[elvisjohndowson]

Hi,
I just found an bug in the OASYS 1.3.3 disk mode functionality. It can audition/playback 44.1 Khz files, but it cannot do so for 48Khz files.

I was trying to create new audio region data, from 44.1Khz files stored in the internal hard drive, and then add them to a song using the OASYS sequencer. I could audition it since using the Play button, since it was recorded to disk using the OASYS at 44.1Khz.

When attempting to create region data, the import functionality will not work unless the files are stored in 48Khz, so I had to use the Rate Convert option to convert the 44.1Khz file to 48Khz. Once you do this, you cannot audition/preview the WAVE file in Disk Mode since it is stored in 48Khz and the Play functionality will only preview files stored in 44.1Khz.

So, you have a situation where you can record files to disk in 44.1Khz, but cannot import the files at 44.1Khz to the sequencer to create region data and
a. audition files at 48Khz after performing a rate conversion
b. having an option in the first place to save the files to disk at 48Khz and avoid the sample rate conversion

I'm feeling even worse about this thing, 'cos I just learnt today that Korg won't be supporting any further OS development for the OASYS.

And they got everyone to justify spending USD$8000 by calling it an Open Architecture system.

Elvis Dowson

[Pieter Meij]

Hello everyone!

First of all a happy new year to all of you!!

Now after reading this post I just have to write my story otherwise there will come smoke out of my ears. I don't want to offend anyone as I understand that most people are very happy with their Oasys and I know that all I want to say has been said before but I just cannot hold my breathe anymore.

I bought my Oasys 88 2,5 years ago...brand new, boxed. After connecting it to my active speakers it started to change combinations at random within two minutes...and I didn't do anything. Ok, ok, ok....power off and on again....yes, everything working fine again. Pffffw! Within two weeks (and just a few hours playing) my keyboard started to make springy noises (not just one key...a lot of them) and they still do. I have to put headphones on...otherwise it is too disturbing.

After a month or so the increment up button did not function anymore...I opened the Oasys, did the best I could and managed to get it working again.

After another month one of the green rotary LED's did not function anymore....still under warranty I got a new rotary encoder board and installed this myself. Ok, Ok don't panic, everything going fine now.

After 1,5 year my joystick did not function properly anymore....ok, ok Oasys back to the dealer and he fixed it for me.

After another month or so, yes the icrement up button stopped working again, hey but now I am experienced so I managed to make it work again and 9 out of 10 times it works fine now!!!

I own it for 2,5 years, I use it only at home, I cover it when I don't use it, I treat it like a baby, I played it maybe for just a few hours a week....what is this???

I am very unhappy with my Oasys and I just want Korg to know this.
To me, the Oasys feels very, very much like an unfinished product.

For example, the fact that you cannot edit programs in combination or song mode really sucks...(and tone adjust is just not the same). I assumed (how wrong) when buying the Oasys that this would be a normal feature for a keyboard in this price range. Even a Yamaha Motif can do this!

And please don't blame the economic crisis for the production/support stop of the Oasys....Everyone knew that you would not sell this keyboard in M1/DX7 quantities!!!

People on this forum are always saying: Ok the Oasys has it's quirks but the sound quality is top notch!!! Well, sorry, I am not convinced. I also have a Roland V-synth and to mo it sounds just better!!

Again, I don't want to take away your enthousiasm if you are happy with your Oasys.....I just want to express my own feelings. Fact is...I barely turn my Oasys on anymore because all the above has spoiled my pleasure of playing this keyboard!

[danatkorg]

Within two weeks (and just a few hours playing) my keyboard started to make springy noises (not just one key...a lot of them) and they still do. I have to put headphones on...otherwise it is too disturbing.

This can be fixed; speak with your Korg distributor. When you asked about this a few months ago, I recommended this solution. Have you had a chance to do this yet?

I own it for 2,5 years, I use it only at home, I cover it when I don't use it, I treat it like a baby, I played it maybe for just a few hours a week....what is this???

It does sound like you have had a number of mechanical problems, and I'm sorry about that. I also note that most of the repair work was done by yourself, which is brave of you! Generally, I would recommend using an authorized service center. It's sometimes possible that in the process of repairing one thing, something else goes wrong. Did you have access to the official service documentation?

For example, the fact that you cannot edit programs in combination or song mode really sucks...

I also wish that we could do this. The Triton and M3 share this same limitation.

People on this forum are always saying: Ok the Oasys has it's quirks but the sound quality is top notch!!! Well, sorry, I am not convinced. I also have a Roland V-synth and to mo it sounds just better!!

That's interesting; I personally find that other synth's aliasing and phasey artifacts to be bothersome. Objectively, I'm certain that it would be quite easy to demonstrate the difference between the two. It does have a distinctive sound, which I'm sure can be effective in the right context. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.

- Dan

[Kevin Nolan]

Pieter,

I understand your frustrations and your point. There's no doubt that even a perfectly working OASYS can be a challenge. It sounds like to me that 'character in sound' is an important issue to you, and as a V-Synth-GT owner, I believe the GT to provide unrivalled and real performance character. Its unique blend of audio technologies and performance controllers and (IMO) Roland's warm effects makes for a very potent blend. The GT is very special.

By comparison, IMO, the 'character' of the OASYS is harder to define; but to me that's both a strength and a weakness. As a weakness, for me, I struggle to make 'blends of sounds' in Combi's that provide for the same sort of multi-timbral setup that I can easily define with a few of my old favourites - the SY99, JD800, Juno106 and CS40M. Despite owning the OASYS for 4 years, I have just finished a one-year job of optimizing the hundreds and hundreds of programs across the various synth-engines of the OASYS and in that process I’m discovering the OASYS’s real character (specific to my needs). But it has taken, and continues to take, a lot of work. So overall, I believe the OASYS needs a lot of work to expose its character for any individual’s musical requirements - and for you (repairs aside) - I'd recommend spending more time with your OASYS – I believe you will discover new depths and character important to you, but will take longer than the more instantaneous character of the GT, because OASYS is more ‘all-encompassing’.

But if this character is harder to define or takes longer to define and harness; this is only because the OASYS IS so all-encompassing and so robust across its various synth engines. It really has multiple personalities, each one very deep. Take for example, the MS20EX emulation. That synthesizer alone could warrant months of full time effort just to get to grips with – it’s THAT capable, and THAT good sounding. Then you have the radical MOD-7 which is both far-reaching in its scope and also instantly seriously useful because it can read the hundreds of thousands of DX/FM patches freely available. And as for AL-1 - Dan's point of the low aliasing oscillators is very significant – this advantage gives AL-1 an incredible flexibility and capability fairly unique in VA synths, allowing you to push the envelope as with an actual analogue synth. Many VA synths, GT included, are more limited in raw, gutsy sound at the low and high end so vital to unprocessed analogue sound.

I could go on about vector synthesis, wave synthesis, huge polyphony with low latency (even when compared to plugins run on the latest Macs), all that make OASYS a hugely liberating instrument. And yes OASYS has real weaknesses such as its sequencer mode and the fact that (for me) Karma is this gargantuan technology that promises so much but continues (for me) to be incredibly frustrating to harness in truly original ways. To this day I find preset Combi’s and Karma GE’s to be a huge source of frustration because (to me) the capabilities of Karma are exactly what I want, but are ridiculously un-user friendly to manage in the ways musicians think. Karma needs to be hugely simplified, and indeed presented in a musical way to the user, not as a programming and parameterised labyrinth.

But I suggest to you that that bottom line for OASYS - and I truly believe this and feel one can stand over this point - is that it is a world-class instrument of real depth of sound (and character) that can hold its own, up front, in the most demanding of musical performances or productions across a plethora of genres. It really is quite unique in this regard, far and beyond any other hardware workstation. The key is to relinquish the unspoken and default view that "because I spent a lot on the OASYS then it had better deliver everything, perfectly, and if it does not, I will view it as flawed" !! Rather - view it as somehting different - as at least a combination of very useful synthesizes, and then with work, an instrument of real depth and character for you. IF you're working at the OASYS in MS20EX mode then treat that with due respect - ie - as a kick-ass semi-modular virtual analogue synthesizer with huge potential, and so on for each of the OASYS's engines, including the very capable HD1, EXs1, 2 and 3.


I'm convinced that its only through the investment of serious time that the best instruments reveal themselves and respond well. I believe OASYS to be firmly in this category and that you should have yours repaired; do not sell it, devote sufficient time to get to know specific aspects of it most valuable to you, and make it work at least in part in your setup. You have an amazing resource sitting there - don't waste it. I genuinely believe you will not regret that investment in OASYS.

Kevin.

[Mike Conway]

Hi,
I just found an bug in the OASYS 1.3.3 disk mode functionality. It can audition/playback 44.1 Khz files, but it cannot do so for 48Khz files.

My OASYS is running 1.3.3 and I just confirmed that it can audition 48K wav files, in Disk mode. Make sure you are auditioning .wav files, as opposed to KSF.

I bought my Oasys 88 2,5 years ago...brand new, boxed. After connecting it to my active speakers it started to change combinations at random within two minutes...and I didn't do anything. Ok, ok, ok....power off and on again....yes, everything working fine again. Pffffw! Within two weeks (and just a few hours playing) my keyboard started to make springy noises (not just one key...a lot of them) .....After a month or so the increment up button did not function anymore...I opened the Oasys, did the best I could and managed to get it working again.

After another month one of the green rotary LED's did not function anymore....still under warranty I got a new rotary encoder board and installed this myself. Ok, Ok don't panic, everything going fine now.

After 1,5 year my joystick did not function properly anymore....ok, ok Oasys back to the dealer and he fixed it for me.

After another month or so, yes the icrement up button stopped working again, hey but now I am experienced so I managed to make it work again and 9 out of 10 times it works fine now!!!

I own it for 2,5 years, I use it only at home, I cover it when I don't use it, I treat it like a baby, I played it maybe for just a few hours a week....what is this???

I've had my 76 key OASYS for more than 4 years. I have a couple of sticky buttons, but all else is fine, even after suffering a nasty drop from a X Stand collapsing. I blame my brother-in-law for messing up my START/STOP button. I came home from work and he was in my bedroom with his Large laptop and books sitting on my OASYS!!!! I could have killed him. It was that night my START/STOP began sticking.

I've heard about springy key sounds on the 88 models. As for the buttons sticking, these are the same on most modern Korg workstations and they do require maintenance, after a while, which I've also experienced with my Roland Fantom, E-MU 4K sampling keyboard and Yamaha SY99. It's a bigger deal with the OASYS, because it is heavier, more expensive and not something I want to leave at a repair center, unless I absolutely have to!

That said, I have never had it serviced and I compose most of my work on it. Since my sequencer START/STOP button requires a lot of pressure, I usually route that to my foot switch; a workaround, until I decide to get it serviced. There's no need for me to bring it in for one or two buttons that take coaxing. However, the OS really should have allowed the touchscreen to double for INCREMENT, DECREMENT, START/STOP, MODE buttons and others. It already doubles for KARMA, Mixer and everything else, so why not the last few buttons?

As for your other issues, it sounds like you got a "lemon" unit, with the Joystick and all. Being a Pentium computer, with a small user base, the OS is not perfect and you will eventually encounter oddities, like the occasional freeze. BTW, when I first got the OASYS, in 2005, I used it and a Fantom FA to score about 40 songs for a project. The Fantom froze more.

I do believe that the OASYS is one of the best sounding instruments, ever. Of course, I don't think it replaces the sound character or say a Virus or a V-Synth (elastic audio is a unique kind of synthesis), but it does many things that those units can't.

And please don't blame the economic crisis for the production/support stop of the Oasys....Everyone knew that you would not sell this keyboard in M1/DX7 quantities!!!

I agree that it would not have sold more, because of limited stock of motherboards, etc. The ceiling was there, no matter what.

As for the "proud flagship," I do think that OS support would have continued, if general Korg sales stayed strong. It was the astounding success of the Triton (and previous instrument lines) that allowed the OASYS to come to fruition. Instead, the economy forced Korg to allocate all resources to stand up their bread winner products (Micro-Korg, M3, M50, Radias, etc.) to stay on top of a bad market.

I think that the M3 got the sequencer upgrade to counter competiton from the Fantom G. I think that the M3 got more sounds to offset the large ROM of the Motif XS.

Again, this is all just my opinion. I sympathize with your mechanical issues and think that you should leave repairs to qualified service technicians. A few years ago, I tried to fix buttons on my Triton, which resulted in me screwing more things up!

[elvisjohndowson]

Hi Mike,

My OASYS is running 1.3.3 and I just confirmed that it can audition 48K wav files, in Disk mode. Make sure you are auditioning .wav files, as opposed to KSF.

Try this out, import an audio CD and store it as a WAVE file on the hard disk. In Disk Mode, you can audition the WAVE file by pressing the Play button. The WAVE file I guess is going to be 16-bit 44.1 KHz since that is the format that is used for audio CDs.

Now, in Disk Mode, go to Utility, and use the Rate Convert menu option, and select the 44.1Khz WAVE file, and give a new name for the 48Khz file.

Once the rate conversion has completed, you will find that the Play button is disabled. If you highlight the 44.1Khz file, the Play button gets re-enabled.

I even tried exiting the Disk Mode, and then re-entered it, just to check, but it always disables rate converted files.

However, if you go to a song, and try to playback a mono-aural audio track that was recorded at 48Khz, Disk mode is able to play it back. I found this out during my experiments with the sequencer.

Perhaps the issue is that Disk mode cannot play back stereo 48Khz files at 16-bits, but can play back mono 48Khz files.

Elvis Dowson

[danatkorg]

Hi Elvis,

Try this out, import an audio CD and store it as a WAVE file on the hard disk.

Can you provide more details on these steps? Are you ripping the CD in sampling mode, or on your computer and then transferring the file via USB?

- Dan

[Pieter Meij]

Hello!

Thank you all for responding to my post...I really appreciate that!

Best regards,

Pieter

[elvisjohndowson]

Hi Dan,

Can you provide more details on these steps? Are you ripping the CD in sampling mode, or on your computer and then transferring the file via USB?

I put an Audio CD in the OASYS drive, and then I ripped the first soundtrack from the Audio CD to the OASYS internal hard drive.

After that, I can audition and play back the ripped WAVE file, using the play button.

Now, if you use the rate convert function in Disk mode/Utility, it perform the rate conversion.

I noticed an additional anomaly which was the rate converted file was slightly smaller in size that the original file. I would have expected the 48Khz file to be larger than the 44.1khz file. So, for example, for test purposes, I ripped the One Republic - Apologize track from their album, which was around 37.8MB (quoting from memory, could be wrong) and the 48Khz rate converted file was around 37.6MB.

Anyway, once you have performed the rate conversion, and select the rate converted file, the Play button gets disabled.

Do let me know if you have been able to replicate this. Else I will send you the audio file, if you can give me an email address, to replicate this at your end.

I also noticed that this issue occurs with files that have been bounced from the sequencer to disk, as a stereo WAVE file.

Best regards,

Elvis Dowson