Can something like this be done on an ESX

mrbeats · Post by **mrbeats** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:42 pm

Just wondering if this could be done as IM a bit hmmm about using the pc all the time http://www.youtube.com/user/KnockSquare ... SW7JthAt3E

AI_Joe · Post by **AI_Joe** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:13 pm

I don't know about the ESX - I hear the live sampling aspects aren't as good as maybe the Roland SP-404SX or the Akai MPC500. Plus the smart media card issue is a pain (I had to go the XD card to SM card adapter route for my EMX). And no stereo in.

This would totally work with the microSampler.

Also, the way Maschine names its recorded samples are atrocious. It time stamps it and it's very hard to change the name in its database. You have much more freedom with moving around recorded samples on the microSampler, IMHO.

mrbeats · Post by **mrbeats** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:36 pm

Thanks for the reply Jo much appreciated.
Do you own/use the Micro Sampler yourself?
I had the Akai 2500 I bought second hand but found it too slow.
The NI Maschine is supposed to be MPC like but it seems a lot smoother than the MPC.
I would get the NI but its the messing about on the computer when it decides it dont want to work then worries me.
Windows isn't built for music no matter how much you tweak it!
Ive read on here quite a few problems about the sequencer on the Micro Sampler too.
Thanks.

Dj Pound · Post by **Dj Pound** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:33 pm

Live sampling aspects? Not quite sure I understand what you mean. Could you please explain? I think the ESX is fairly versatile in that department IMHO

AI_Joe · Post by **AI_Joe** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:40 pm

Yeah, I own the microSampler. It's great for what I use it for, although I don't do much sampling of existing music. I mainly use it for grabbing hits and one offs and throw it into a chain with other gear. The sequencer is very basic, and you'll do better with other samplers for that. It is still functional, however, and it's quantize and overdub feature makes it easy to throw together a good beat really easy.

I also own the Maschine, and it is very fast in terms of laying down multiple banks of samples. The sequencer is very adequate. It's a great piece of hardware/software, but I seem to be able to grab samples faster on the microSampler. However, the Maschine can apply 2 effects per sample, 2 per bank, and 2 on the master output - the microSampler can only handle 1 effect globally (you can get around this by resampling alot). Having the Maschine tethered to a computer is both a strength and weakness. The strength is having virtually unlimited storage and processing power (as far as your PC takes it). The weakness is that it's hard to toss it into a bag and roll somewhere else without having to turn on your computer, start the program, etc. Also the software update releases are very far between. Take a look at the NI Maschine forum and you'll see all the gripes users have with the software - but like every other product, it depends on how the users use it, I guess.

The guy in the video is obviously very used to moving around the Maschine hardware - it takes some time knowing how it flows. I've never used an MPC so I can't tell you the pros and cons between the two - but if you want an all-in-one machine and you want it to act like an MPC, your best bet is an MPC. With a computer, the Maschine isn't a bad choice.

Also look into the upcoming Beat Thang hardware - it will supposedly blow the MPC out of the water as a standalone, but it hasn't been release yet (the virtual edition has).

Dj Pound wrote:Live sampling aspects? Not quite sure I understand what you mean. Could you please explain? I think the ESX is fairly versatile in that department IMHO

Grabbing samples on the fly as in the video. I don't know, as I don't own one, but a few people I talk to that do own it say that it is clunky in that regard. If you say differently, then I would believe you. I am buying an ESX next month to go with my EMX, so I'm not trying to dissuade anybody on it.

mrbeats · Post by **mrbeats** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:56 pm

IM a bit confused now lol.
Can I build up a groove like that guy in the video with a micro sampler?
I will be just using it for capturing live ideas then I will move over to the pc for serious effects ect.
How quickly can you edit the samples on the micro korg?
Is it as easy as this guy made it look on the NI?
As you have probably guessed Im looking at buying one of the two.
Thanks guys.

AI_Joe · Post by **AI_Joe** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:15 pm

mrbeats wrote:IM a bit confused now lol.
Can I build up a groove like that guy in the video with a micro sampler?
I will be just using it for capturing live ideas then I will move over to the pc for serious effects ect.
How quickly can you edit the samples on the micro korg?
Is it as easy as this guy made it look on the NI?
As you have probably guessed Im looking at buying one of the two.
Thanks guys.

Yes. He is grabbing parts of the record, editing the start and end of the sample, and then throwing it into the sequencer. You can do this just as fast in the MicroSampler. The only thing else he's doing that you can't do on the MicroSampler is apply multiple effects to one sample (you can apply one effect type to samples across the bank or resample to get more).

But if DJ Pound says that this can be done as easily on the ESX - I would go with the ESX, as it has more power and features.

(But does, however, have one mother of a brick power adapter

while the MicroSampler can be battery powered)

If you still can't decide, then maybe taking a look at both manuals (PDFs on the Korg site) to see how they operate. FYI, the microSampler menu options can be access quickly by holding down the edit button and pressing the corresponding marked key - the manual glosses over that.

mrbeats · Post by **mrbeats** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:39 pm

Dj Pound wrote:Live sampling aspects? Not quite sure I understand what you mean. Could you please explain? I think the ESX is fairly versatile in that department IMHO

Could you please explain with one slice part how the esx could possibly do what this guy is doing on the video please as i cant see it being possible.

AI_Joe · Post by **AI_Joe** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:55 pm

Correction: the ESX does do stereo input, via a TRS connection. My bad.

I'm looking over the manual now, to see how it works.

The Korg.com website does not offer the manual. The Korg UK site does:

http://www.korg.co.uk/downloads/ESX1/su ... Manual.pdf

Dj Pound · Post by **Dj Pound** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:27 am

Yeah, my bad. You guys are right! Disregard what I said earlier

I got my machines mixed up **Tired**
The Microsampler is awesome in that regard i.e. sampling fast, multiple different ways on the fly. Its definetly more versatile in that way as compared to the ESX. That said, from a bit of research that Ive done. It seems that the Microsamplers sequencer isnt as fully implemented as the ESX's i.e you cant do any motion sequencing or filter sweeps etc..

Thats kind of a bummer.

AI_Joe · Post by **AI_Joe** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:40 am

mrbeats wrote:
Dj Pound wrote:Live sampling aspects? Not quite sure I understand what you mean. Could you please explain? I think the ESX is fairly versatile in that department IMHO
Could you please explain with one slice part how the esx could possibly do what this guy is doing on the video please as i cant see it being possible.

He's not slicing. He's merely grabbing one shots and trimming them and then pitching some of the samples down. Slicing takes a longer sample and slices it according to a set number of beats. If I understand it correctly, the ESX has 1 sample per drum part (9 parts), 2 keyboard parts which pitches a sample up and down the keyboard, 2 stretch parts which allows for 2 looped samples (like sampled drum loops) which can be tempo-stretched, and 1 slice part, in which a drum loop can be cut up into smaller beats and then played out of sequence. I'm guessing all this. From the manual it looks like you have to record the sample first, tweak it, then assign it to one of the 9 slots in the drum parts, then sequence it.

The microSampler has 36 sample slots per bank (8 banks) - 1 bank can be accessed at a time, the samples can either be looped or one shots - with one sample specified as a keyboard part.

The Maschine has 16(x8 banks) slots - all can be triggered at the same time, any slot can be used as a keyboard part.

Dj Pound wrote:It seems that the Microsamplers sequencer isnt as fully implemented as the ESX's i.e you cant do any motion sequencing or filter sweeps etc.. Thats kind of a bummer.

It's a linear sequencer, not a step sequencer (the ESX offers both) - and yeah, it's basic. You can quantize record and overdub. The good thing is you can have up to 99 measures per pattern and 16 patterns per bank.

You can do filter sweeps, it just takes up the one and only effect you have. You could sweep while resampling, but then you lose the spontaneity of doing different sweepings. There is no automation (i.e. motion sequencing) which is unfortunate - but I usually record pattern loops from the MS into Ableton Live and automate that stuff to my heart's content.

I'm still eager to get the ESX to add to my rig. EMX, ESX, microSampler, microKorgXL, KP3, Mini-KP, Kaossilator, all chained up with MIDI and a 10 channel mixer?? It will be awesome.

gil videla · Post by **gil videla** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:03 pm

mrbeats wrote:Thanks for the reply Jo much appreciated.
Do you own/use the Micro Sampler yourself?
I had the Akai 2500 I bought second hand but found it too slow.
The NI Maschine is supposed to be MPC like but it seems a lot smoother than the MPC.
I would get the NI but its the messing about on the computer when it decides it dont want to work then worries me.
Windows isn't built for music no matter how much you tweak it!
Ive read on here quite a few problems about the sequencer on the Micro Sampler too.
Thanks.

You can save 200 bux if you order the Machine EDU version, it's the same, only once you own it, you can't resell it (well you can't resell the license with it) but for 200 less, it's cheaper than a new ESX!!! Can't go wrong in my opinion

mrbeats · Post by **mrbeats** » Wed Dec 23, 2009 2:27 pm

Thanks for all your help guys.
I found a second hand version of Maschine for £350 so bought it.
Its ok but IM not happy.
The fact its connected to the pc just stops me from being spontaneous.
It works ok but its not hardware so my fault I guess.
IM just going to buy an ESX after I get my M50 in January.
I would also like to get my hands on an MPC 1000 just to play around with its workflow after using the Native Instruments Maschine as I can imagine its very fun.
Oh toys toys toys lol just need them all.
Bit like when I was a kid with toy cars I just had to collect more.

Its all good fun though isnt it

Just realised you can get a software app for the EMX to turn it into a poly synth too!
Amazing stuff cant wait to play.
Thanks again everyone.

Yornav · Post by **Yornav** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:48 am

Yeh... can't have enough toys either

...