MartinHines wrote:... the market just isn't big enough, especially since most of your target buyers already own an OASYS.
I am having my internal argument about that one here Primarily because I don't have any concrete information to play with.
On the face of it I agree with you, but at the same time I have some experience with this kind of high value niche product myself and that has taught me that things are not so simple; Oasys style products go through two phases in terms of sales. The first phase is selling the product to a smaller group of customers who already understand why the product is worthwhile and at the same time educating a larger section of the market as to why spending twice or three times as much as they are accustomed is worthwhile, so they will buy it in the second phase. I think we are already coming into that second phase now. It's when you have caught that second group's interest that it is worth doing some kind of re-launch to capitalize on it. You don't just saturate an existing market with this kind of product and then bail, you actually have to create a new market for it if you want to be successful.
Maybe that's the wrong way to look at things and the Oasys sales will instead just tail off. As someone once commented, there is a possibility that only in a few years time will people really appreciate how great this machine was and saddened that it drifted out of production. That's happened with Korg products before. They were better than many people understood at the time and went out of production before that realization occurred.
Don't think for a minute that there isn't an office somewhere in Korg Japan where there's a lucky little fella trudging away on an OASYS on steroids.
I'd be surprised if the technology isn't being tested at least. Lets not forget this project has been ongoing for 10 years or more....I'm sure Korg have a road map for OASYS technology for many a year to come.It's been filtered through the M3 and Radias....they ain't gonna stand still.
OASYS II ,ok we may clutching at straw's,big wishful thinking but the prospect of making something what is sooooo goood now even better really wets my appetite.
Plus I'm waiting for my Bling OASYS ala Neko 5th anniversary edition....come on Korg bring on the gold!!!!!!...................................... (What the hell is that all about I ask you)?????
Here's one way to look at it. Korg has a finite number of AOpen motherboards. When that supply is exhausted they have two choices: discontinue the OASYS or release an updated model. In the later case, they could try to find a similar motherboard, which might be difficult and still require work adapting the current system to it, or they could use it as an opportunity to do a hardware refresh, using a new motherboard, new processor, more memory, larger hard drive, etc. The idea of a new sound card also sounds reasonable since it would likely only require a new driver and some hardware integration.
I agree that it probably won't be called "OASYS II" since it would only be an upgrade in specs, not features. But "Rev. B" would be an understatement. Leave it to Korg's marketing to decide a name that a) wouldn't raise undue expectations but b) gain enough attention to attract new customers and convince current owners to upgrade.
Keep your ears open, guys. Let us know if anyone else hears any other rumors on this.
I think that we can all agree that Korg isn't standing still. MarkF is I'm sure also right in that there are only so many parts around to service the current generation of Oasys's.
The Oasys platform has also been released for over 3 years at least from the announcement, and almost 3 years since product delivery. Some of the hardware specs that made the Oasys so impressive 3 years ago are less impressive today. The funny thing is that the Oasys still kicks butt in raw processing power over anything else out there, save the Neko. I'm not saying that certain competing boards don't do some things better than the Oasys, but things like 172-note polyphony and dynamic allocation of resources still aren't being met by the competitors.
I'm always interested in seeing how people use their equipment. This factors heavily into people's opinions of a particular manufacturer's gear.
Take me for example: I can't live without a good Hammond simulator. That leaves Roland and Yamaha out of the picture immediately. I don't understand why neither of those guys have ever put terribly much time into this. Yes I know that Roland has the VK series, but as far as I know they've never bundled it into a Fantom.
I also need layers and lots of polyphony. I use the sampler maybe twice a year, the sequencer 10 times a year. I use the crap out of real-time controllers and anything live performance related.
My Kurzweil PC3x is being delivered today; i'm buying it as a backup to my Oasys. I can't justify another $6000 to have a second Oasys sitting in my basement waiting for my primary to die, but my stable of backup boards has been aging, and to be honest, totally collecting dust since I got the Oasys in 2005. I've needed something modern that can do at least most of what I do on the Oasys.
Kurzweil has had lots of calendar time since their last product release - I'm very excited to see how that has translated into a cool instrument. I do know that it doesn't have anywhere near the processing power of the Oasys - 128 polyphony, 16U of effects power, but some effects take several "U". It's also 1/3 the price of the Oasys.
What Kurzweil does well - they cram tons of power into a machine without the flash. Their stuff also sounds fantastic. I haven't heard much of the PC3 yet, but I've owned tons of other Kurzweil stuff and they are ahead of the curve, at least when they initially release a product.
What Kurzweil has in the past done poorly - business execution, stock preset design (when you walk up to a K2600 it sounds like 1995, but if you tweak stuff, it sounds great), marketing. Hopefully new management can straighten this stuff out. Having talked with Dave Weiser the head of Kurz R&D, I believe they are back and will be a formidable competitor.
Roland with the Fantom G appears to have a killer sequencer. I think the 512MB song limit and the use of PC133 DIMMS is ridiculous. I've never liked a Roland workstation product since the XP-80. All of the fantoms (haven't seen the G yet, so am reserving judgement) neutered the useful controllers and navigation system of the XP-80 in favor of the stupid D-beam thing and knobs.
Yamaha is very progressive and I like a lot of their sounds. The Motif XS is a great product and in a parallel universe I would probably own one. They have a funny performance mode structure, and as I complained above, have never had a reasonable Hammond synth.
Clavia - I totally don't understand them. I like the size of the Electro, but it's hardly a competitor to a flagship synth. Even the stage seems like it would be better placed in 1995. They're just now getting some basic MIDI control functionality, and the piano still sounds like crap.
Of everything out there for what I do, the Oasys has nailed it. Even after 3 years, no one, probably not even Kurzweil, can beat the Oasys for what I use.
Looking forward, I think Korg has a market for a new Oasys. I don't think they can get $8000 for it, but they've also gotten a fair return on the R&D from the current Oasys, so maybe they won't have to.
If I were Korg, I would release an Oasys II for $4999 that has a modern computer in it (Dual-core something, 4-8GB RAM, larger laptop drive - 320GB-500GB, higher-res screen - 1024X768 with optional mouse control, but don't lose the touchscreen), is based on the Oasys software in general, but answer the main gripes of the current board: Sequencer, make patch editing possible in Combi mode, more polyphony, more effects inserts, better sample rate conversions and a usable multi-track recorder like the Roland VS series.
I think that Oasys I patches should be forward compatible to Oasys II and that Korg should try to come up with some sort of software upgrade to bring some of the new features to the Oasys I platform, but to be honest I don't like to chain down the designers too much with backwards compatibility, because that slows down forward progress.
You are right Daz. On reflection, this is probably just wild speculation. I can't see it that local suppliers would have such insight.
Furthermore, I cannot see an OASYS 2 emerging unless its a radically different product, in which case it would not be OASYS as we know it. Simply adding new processors for greater polyphony or an updated keyboard action would be a rediculous strategy and would come in for huge criticism. In reality what an OASYS 2 would need to justify itself in the market place would either be revolutionary new feature set with incredible character that would have to be significant enough to justify the cost all over gain and hence leave OASYS as it is standing, or else a device with the plethora of featrues many are sceaming for such as tight integration with DAWs, modularity of hardware DSP, compatibility with VST/AU, among a host of others demands that would in effect render OASYS null-and-void as an inependent workstation (and remember - Korg are a hardware company). Either way such an instrument would not be OASYS as we know it.
It is more likely that the current OS and relatively monir update process is the one Korg will follow through for another year or two before departing onto somethig comletely different.
Care to discuss??????
Kevin.
(Why did I type all this - I hate these discussions - but we just can't help ourselves !!!)
Vadim wrote:OASYS II???
it's the most UNLOGICAL, Stupidest assumption i ever heard....
Why ?
why do you need OASYS II, if current OASYS is good enough, it works on software anyway, so it means OASYS I can live for years and years, just keep on updating the software....
What would you expect in OASYS II? larger screen? different color?
yes the hardware can be updated, but than they should still call it OASYS anyway, maybe just on the serial number plate specify the year model, that would make more sense, than OASYS II.
I don't think you'll see your revolution until the next product cycle, which I feel will be a totally new platform. The Oasys is (very roughly speaking) a bunch of amazing synth/karma tech sitting inside a M1/Trinity/Triton style world. The next gen product will marry these new engines we know and love into a whole new world that doesn't look anything like a Triton and has a completely different architecture and operating paradigm. Watch for the Korg M5 Pro at NAMM 2010 In the meantime watch for the M3 LE and maybe an Oasys rev B.
Vadim wrote:why do you need OASYS II, if current OASYS is good enough, it works on software anyway, so it means OASYS I can live for years and years, just keep on updating the software....
It's about production logistics and marketing, as much as anything else.
The fact that they would upgrade hardware would be in-line with what the Oasys was made to do. There are things it should and could do, and it would be an upgrade just like you would have to pay for the software. It makes sense to me that they would do that especially if they are charging around the same price for it. And if the older users wanted it, im sure they'd pay a lil extra to upgrade the motherboard, just like they would the OS and EX's.
Noooo,new OASYS please
This OASYS was expensive enough.Do you really want to save up another £5000 or so?This OASYS is so deep and complex surely we don't need another one.It takes a lifetime to work this one out.If a new OASYS comes our way than our old O will loose it's value over night and it won't be special any more.At the moment we are very privileged to own "THE one and only OASYS".
Au contraire ... the Oasys will remain an extraordinarily special instrument as the Wavedrum or the Oasys PCI, regardless of what might come after it.
I predict the Oasys II will have a dark brown themed design, in keeping with the green motif of the Motif ... inspired by the new fashion of eco-friendliness in look and design. Synths for the Wholefoods generation. Very California
Primarily because I don't have any concrete information to play with.
