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EnjoyRC
Platinum Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2008
Posts: 746
Location: John 3:16
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 Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Zeroesque wrote: | Nah...fighter jet vs. bomber!  |
Ahhh... better analogy
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Korg (Kronos 88, RK-100S 2), Behringer DeepMind 12, Roland (GAIA, A-800-Pro) |
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ozy
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| ScoobyDoo555 wrote: | | Out of interest Ozy, what's making you change your mind?DAn |
It's totally peculiar and personal.
The logic goes as follows:
0) I'd rather like a semiweighted. But that's not feasible, so:
1) Kronos lacks serious modeled brass and woodwind engines, which are paramount to me.
2) Kronos still has some limitations as a masterkeybord.
Oddly enough, one of them is its reliance on the screen, which everybody wants bigger and deeper, but which is a pest when setting a keyboard as "the bottom one".
I'd love less screen and more physical sliders and knobs, possibly located near the keys (under this profile, the jupiter 80 has nice solutions as a bottom keyboard. will test them A/B before any decision).
3) because of 1) and 2), I cannot radically change my setup and make the Kronos my bottom keyboard, much less my only keyboard.
It is an "expander" for me.
4) hence, I need to physically locate it as a "top keyboard" with solo functions [master for the analogues], while its EP engine is driven by a semiweighted bottom keyboard.
5) I am worried by for the 0, 1 and 2 limitations. This doesn't entice me to spending 1000 bucks more for the 88.
But if I overcome the doubt and buy it,
6) the only way is: I'll probably replace the current main "top-solo" masterkeyboard (a korg ... t3, 20 years old... ) with the kronos.
Then I'll slowly fade out the M3 as well (which is currently seated as a tilted "panel" above the t3).
This is the only way out I found to two "mistakes" (IMHO): lack of Kronos expander, and lack of Kronos semiweighted (and obsolete, sampled orchestrals).
If the kronos had modeled brass and was 76 semiweighted, the PC3 would go and the kronos would sit bottom.
As you may see, it's totally peculiar to my setup and to my appreciation of the Kronos' points of strenght and weakness. |
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ScoobyDoo555
Platinum Member
Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 840
Location: Herefordshire, UK
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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Funnily enough, it's not as personal as you might think -
points 1-4 are the same for me
point 5 - I've already got an A80 & KX88
point 6 - same as (I've got an XP30 that is slowly going out to pasture!)
With my own sound palette of hardware, Kronos is simply an bolt-on, expander (same as you)
Dan
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Yamaha SY77 & KX88, SSL Nucleus, Korg Kronos 61, Wavestation A/D, Access Virus B, Roland XP30, DeepMind12D, System 1m, V-Synth XT, Focusrite Red16Line, Unitor 8, Akai S3000 XL, Alesis Quadraverb+, Focal Shape Twins, Full fat iMac, Logic Pro X, ProTools 2021, loadsa plugins.
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EXer
Platinum Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Location: France
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| jemkeys25 wrote: | | thats funny, cause kurzweil released the 88 pc3k8 first, and i want the 76, the pc3k8 has been out for months, so go figure, i guess kurzweil said they'd go the safe route first, and release the 88, that sells better than the 61 from what i've read. |
I guess it's because the PC3K is aimed more towards the stage piano market than towards the synth market (Kurz themselves name their PC3s "performance controller keyboards", not "synthesizers" nor "workstations").
Just my 2 cents...
Last edited by EXer on Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Zeroesque
Senior Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Posts: 451
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| EXer wrote: | | jemkeys25 wrote: | | thats funny, cause kurzweil released the 88 pc3k8 first, and i want the 76, the pc3k8 has been out for months, so go figure, i guess kurzweil said they'd go the safe route first, and release the 88, that sells better than the 61 from what i've read. |
I guess it's because the PC3K is aimed more towards the stage piano market than towards the synth market (just my 2 cents...). |
The PC series has historically been just that. I think they also had a long stretch of time between the K2000 (VP?) and the K2661 where they didn't even have a 61. The 61 key versions of the PC3 came out after their larger brethren, as well.
I'm sure both companies make these decisions based upon some hard manufacturing and sales facts that we clearly can't know. They can't make them all at the same time, certainly, so something's got to go first.
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Kronos 61, Kronos2-88, Hammond B3, Baldwin SD-10 |
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ozy
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| EXer wrote: | | I guess it's because the PC3K is aimed more towards the stage piano market than towards the synth market (just my 2 cents...). |
yes. That's it.
I would have never bought the pc3 (which I'll upgrade to pc3k as soon as the 76 is available) as an "expander" (i.e.: just because of its sound engine). I couldn't care less of a pc3k-61 (   ).
Pc3 is a stage piano/master [good keys, above all great controllers: breath, ribbon, the works, a great layout], hence 76/88 by definition, with a good sound engine, at a killer price (I paid mine 1300 euros,new. A used roland A90 goes for 800. So, 500 bucks for one year warranty plus some very nice sounds plus balanced outs? It's a no-brainer).
Don't compare it with the Kronos, compare it with the nord stage... Ask your ears, hands, backbone and wallet, and they will tell you why.
The kronos has a superior sound engine. You pay for that the extra 1500 bucks.
This is why I didn't want to pay for the Kronos' keys and knobs 
And that's why IMO people are buying the less keys they can.
IF the trend towards the 61 will confirmed (it's currently limited to japan, and so it doesn't make for serious statistics: everybody else is in the "Ford-T trap": either 61, or wait, so of course many will go for the 61) |
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EnjoyRC
Platinum Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2008
Posts: 746
Location: John 3:16
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| ozy wrote: | | This is why I didn't want to pay for the Kronos' keys and knobs |
Ozy said knobs!!!!!  It's gonna be another one of those threads 
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Korg (Kronos 88, RK-100S 2), Behringer DeepMind 12, Roland (GAIA, A-800-Pro) |
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ozy
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| EnjoyRC wrote: | | Ozy said knobs!!!!! It's gonna be another one of those threads |
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operaman
Full Member
Joined: 05 Aug 2006
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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Ozy makes some good points. I am keeping my PC3X as my master controller, and will then put the Kronos above it as a 61 key expander. It is a perfect setup for me.
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Korg Kronos 61::Kurzweil PC3X::Alesis Fusion 8HD::Korg Microstation::DSI Prophet 08:::Korg Polysix::2X Oberheim Matrix 1000 |
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JPWC
Platinum Member
Joined: 29 Oct 2010
Posts: 638
Location: Bay Area, CA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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While positioning is not normally a concern for me in the studio.
I've pre-ordered the Kronos 61, it will on top, with a Fantom G7 on the bottom. This will be my live performance setup. I lose the unused D-beam function on the Fantom, but I don't use it. Additionally I use a monotron, which is velcro'ed to the Fantom G7 open area, along with a EHX Cathedral (reverb) for the monotron.
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Kronos-6, Krome, M3, Radias, KingKorg, microKorg, KP-2, KP-3, KO-1, KO-1 PRO, Karma, microX, monotron, monotribe, PadCONTROL, Wavedrum Mini, Volca Keys, Beats, Bass, Sample, monotron Duo & Delay, microArranger, M1, Wavestation, Volca Sample, Keys, Beats & Bass, MS-20
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Chriskk
Senior Member
Joined: 10 May 2011
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:47 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | actually, 88's (historically) have always outsold 61's according to my dealer. |
I highly doubt it. More 01/W's. T3's, Trinities and Tritons were produced than their 88 key counterparts. |
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rob314159
Full Member
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Posts: 249
Location: Virginia, US
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| Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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From the SN list at Karma-Lab
http://www.karma-lab.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9492
At least for the M3, the 61-key was by far the best seller based on max SN:
61 - 10293
73 - 3443
88 - 4395
Module - 1926
And, based on that, it's not that difficult to see why there is no Kronos module. |
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