Korg Forums Forum Index Korg Forums
A forum for Korg product users and musicians around the world.
Moderated Independently.
Owned by Irish Acts Recording Studio & hosted by KORG USA
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Why Do Intros/Endings Not Respect the Chord Sequence?
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korg Forums Forum Index -> Korg Pa5X
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Basspig
Full Member


Joined: 29 Jan 2020
Posts: 134

PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2024 12:58 am    Post subject: Why Do Intros/Endings Not Respect the Chord Sequence? Reply with quote

When playing styles with a chord sequence, why doesn't the intro and endings respect the key that the chord sequence is in? It instead jumps to Cmaj when I select any End button and it's often jarring.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
leland_iko_music
Junior Member


Joined: 30 Jul 2023
Posts: 62
Location: Paris area, France

PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2024 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have noticed this for quite a lot of styles, so I tend to avoid using the end variants at all, and just simply fade-out with the master volume.

L.
_________________
Keyboards: Korg PA5X-88, Kawai ES8 | Loopstation Boss RC505mk2 | Boss FS-6 | Nektar Pacer | Multitrack Recording: Tascam 2488 | Software: OBS Studio, Loopback, Logic Pro X, Mainstage3
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
F-Minor



Joined: 07 Mar 2023
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

leland_iko_music wrote:
I have noticed this for quite a lot of styles, so I tend to avoid using the end variants at all, and just simply fade-out with the master volume.

L.

Why not the fade out button? So that you can still play some chords and melody during the fade out? I use it in some of my videos, see link below. For instance in the Feels Like Heaven and We Might As Well Be Strangers performances.
_________________
Musical greetz,

F-Minor

PA5X 88 (& I love it! Smile )

YT: https://www.youtube.com/@FransV2010
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JagiChan
Full Member


Joined: 20 Aug 2023
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 11:11 am    Post subject: Re: Why Do Intros/Endings Not Respect the Chord Sequence? Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
When playing styles with a chord sequence, why doesn't the intro and endings respect the key that the chord sequence is in? It instead jumps to Cmaj when I select any End button and it's often jarring.


Some of the styles maybe "only playback programmed" for intros/endings. In that case "CMaj" is the chord chosen by default. Not sure how it is done in Korg PA5X. However, I have seen it in some PSR series styles, where chord changes are not respected for intros and endings; and when I did spend sometime making styles using "Style Works from EMC", I realized that there is a playback option too.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
karmathanever
Platinum Member


Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 10404

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the PA4x the ENDING 1 will always play out in the key of the Chord Sequence, ENDINGS 2 & 3 will play using the chord sequence chords. In all cases it never jumps to Cmaj.

Never tried this on the PA5x

Very Happy
_________________
PA4X-76, Karma, WaveDrum GE, Fantom 8 EX
------------------------------------------------------------------
## Please stay safe ##
...and play lots of music Very Happy
------------------------------------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carsten



Joined: 01 Oct 2023
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 6:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Why Do Intros/Endings Not Respect the Chord Sequence? Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
When playing styles with a chord sequence, why doesn't the intro and endings respect the key that the chord sequence is in? It instead jumps to Cmaj when I select any End button and it's often jarring.


I think you do not refer to fixed or parallel "note transposition table" as described in the manual from page 814 on. The Sequences are in a certain key and Intros/Endings often react to the chords that you play (note transposition table is "parallel"). Mostly they are not in a fixed key (although that's possible to configure here). If you look into the sequences for the correct key, then you can play that key once while starting the Intros, play the sequences with the Variations and end also in the correct key as you have played that during the Intro. It's a bit tricky, but as you normally play the styles in all keys it would not be helpful to programme the Intros/Endings in the key of the sequences.
It is possilble though to set a fixed key (see the manual pp. 814 ff), then of course you are stuck with that key.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AntonySharmman
Approved Merchant
Approved Merchant


Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 3598
Location: Hellas

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carsten wrote the obvious , nothing compared with Pa4X that works with preset chord sequencing of midi events in CV in fixed mode.
- External chord sequencing inputs work only in Pa5X and work only in parallel mode style tracks and not in CV fixed midi events.
- When you apply manually different chords while INTRO and ENDING of factory Styles then you will understand of how this works.
In other words , playing an external sequence file , when using a factory Style's INTRO or ENDING , you just play in parallel 2 sequencers
data and you mess up the result of Style since INTRO & ENDING already contain another chord sequence in fixed mode.
- If you want to play with external chord sequence inputs , then you have to create INTRO & ENDING in parallel midi events manually in custom
styles or just use VAR & Fills only and stop or fade out Style.


Hope this helps
_________________
Music Conductor - Sound Engineer & Developer - Automotive SMPS/RF R&D - Electronics Engineer
PaSeries Demos - WavesArt.eu - KorgPa.gr <> Facebook

Keyboards : Steinway-D, Kronos X, Pa5X 76, Pa4X 76, Montage M7 , Roland-XV88, Emu3,Emax II,Synclavier II,Yamaha DX Series, ΟΒ-8V
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
leland_iko_music
Junior Member


Joined: 30 Jul 2023
Posts: 62
Location: Paris area, France

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2024 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

F-Minor wrote:
leland_iko_music wrote:
I have noticed this for quite a lot of styles, so I tend to avoid using the end variants at all, and just simply fade-out with the master volume.

L.

Why not the fade out button? So that you can still play some chords and melody during the fade out? I use it in some of my videos, see link below. For instance in the Feels Like Heaven and We Might As Well Be Strangers performances.


Simply because I do mostly live-looping with the loopstation, so half the time I fade-out on that ..

Will check your links though for when I do occasionally use styles on the 5X ..

Thanks for the tip !

Leland
_________________
Keyboards: Korg PA5X-88, Kawai ES8 | Loopstation Boss RC505mk2 | Boss FS-6 | Nektar Pacer | Multitrack Recording: Tascam 2488 | Software: OBS Studio, Loopback, Logic Pro X, Mainstage3
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Basspig
Full Member


Joined: 29 Jan 2020
Posts: 134

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry for my delayed response (I had a major heart attack on Friday and was just released from the hospital after a stent implant in my LAD artery).

I never like to use fades as it's symbolic of poor musicianship not to know how to end a song properly.

Some of the discussion of how this works is over my head. Parallel chords and all that stuff. If there is a way to fix it so it works that would help. If it's not a problem on Pa4X, why would they break it on Pa5X?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
karmathanever
Platinum Member


Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 10404

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
(I had a major heart attack on Friday and was just released from the hospital after a stent implant in my LAD artery)


So sorry to hear - hope you are OK
Take care

Pete Very Happy
_________________
PA4X-76, Karma, WaveDrum GE, Fantom 8 EX
------------------------------------------------------------------
## Please stay safe ##
...and play lots of music Very Happy
------------------------------------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JagiChan
Full Member


Joined: 20 Aug 2023
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
Sorry for my delayed response (I had a major heart attack on Friday and was just released from the hospital after a stent implant in my LAD artery).


Sorry to hear about your heart attack. Hope you are doing well now. Wishing you a speedy recovery. Take rest for now until you are completely healed, the PA5X can wait.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AntonySharmman
Approved Merchant
Approved Merchant


Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 3598
Location: Hellas

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
If it's not a problem on Pa4X, why would they break it on Pa5X?

First , I wish you fast recovery and take care.

You can't insert in Pa4X an external chord sequence , you can only edit INTROs / Endings in fixed / non transpose mode and write midi events.
In Pa5X , factory Styles INTRO/ENDING have already a chord sequence written in midi events , so you can't apply extra chord changes while playing.

For instance play manually a factory Style Ending and while playing change playing chords , this will disturb the preset fixed chord sequencing and
will mess up chords harmony , an external chord sequence will do the same if chords are changing while ENDING plays.


Hope this helps
_________________
Music Conductor - Sound Engineer & Developer - Automotive SMPS/RF R&D - Electronics Engineer
PaSeries Demos - WavesArt.eu - KorgPa.gr <> Facebook

Keyboards : Steinway-D, Kronos X, Pa5X 76, Pa4X 76, Montage M7 , Roland-XV88, Emu3,Emax II,Synclavier II,Yamaha DX Series, ΟΒ-8V
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Basspig
Full Member


Joined: 29 Jan 2020
Posts: 134

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks everyone for your kind remarks. I've a long recovery ahead and will have to be on meds the rest of my remaining life. The chest pains are gone, but blood thinners make me feel dizzy and have frequent nose bleeds.
About the only thing I CAN do is play with my Pa5X at this point. No outdoor projects that involve heavy lifting.

From what Antony is saying, I guess that there are certain limitations in the style function with regard to endings and chord sequences. Perhaps future software updates will address these issues.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Biggles
Platinum Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2017
Posts: 1013

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
Sorry for my delayed response (I had a major heart attack on Friday and was just released from the hospital after a stent implant in my LAD artery).

I never like to use fades as it's symbolic of poor musicianship not to know how to end a song properly.

Some of the discussion of how this works is over my head. Parallel chords and all that stuff. If there is a way to fix it so it works that would help. If it's not a problem on Pa4X, why would they break it on Pa5X?


Best wishes.

It sucks having health issues.
_________________
Biggles
Lancashire, UK
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JagiChan
Full Member


Joined: 20 Aug 2023
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2024 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basspig wrote:
...About the only thing I CAN do is play with my Pa5X at this point...

Someone's signature on this forum states "Life is short play a Korg". I am convinced that this person is right.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korg Forums Forum Index -> Korg Pa5X All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group