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Kronos - is that fake as Roland digital emulations or real?
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GregC
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Joined: 15 May 2002
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Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)

PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Musicwithharry wrote:
It is funny how Behringer gets thrown under the bus when we are talking about stuff like this. They actually make good stuff and have for a while now. In their earlier days, they were bottom of the barrel in quality. Now, their stuff is truly world class.

One cannot deny their success in the market. Their mixers are good (I have a number of them in my studio and live rigs), their speakers seem to be doing well, and their synths are generating more interest than any other company right now.

Is it bad that they are creating synths based on older synths from other companies? I do not see the problem. They are taking the 'original' and improving upon it. Their Deepmind synth may be patterned from a Roland analog unit, but they improved upon it such that it has its own character. It is hugely popular and the users really seem to like it.

Their Model D has generated more buzz in recent memory than any other synth that I know of.

It is funny how they seem to be upping the game and people seem to be upset that they are. Korg is the only other company, that I know of, that actually has a line of analog that is useful. Soft-synths and VA units just do not sound the same (but they are close).

I cannot fault Behringer at all for what they've done, as they have opened up the equipment for many more users. How many people can afford the original Roland 808? Not many. How many people can afford the Behringer RD-8? Almost everybody. It sounds like the original, acts like the original, and has a few features the original did not have that allow it to integrate better in the modern studio/live setups.

We easily forget that the high end synths we buy today are mostly emulating original analog/acoustic instruments. Soft synths do the same thing, but often are in much greater detail. I prefer hardware synths and do not use soft-synths at all. We seem to gloss over the fact that the piano samples in the Korg are Yamaha/Fazioli/Steinway grands and compared to the originals of these and use them anyway. Korg's HD engine has been around since the OASYS, and still sounds great and is relevant today. Even the little Kross has good sounds in it, derived from the HD engine. The M3 had the EDS engine (as did the M50). The Krome uses it, the Kross has the EDS-i engine. The Kronos still has the HD engine because it is relevant.

Korg, Roland, and Yamaha are in a good position. Korg may be in the best situation of all, of those three. Yamaha is too pricey, even for their quality, Roland is trying new technologies, and Korg is staying the course with gear for all user and price levels.

Behringer has a name problem that they seem to be overcoming well. They were known for low quality gear that failed much of the time and now their name is much different. Their only real problem now is availability of these new products.

Casio is in a similar situation because they are known as the 'consumer toy' category, even though A LOT of their stuff is really great. The Privia is an exception because it brought great piano action and such to the market and people wanted that. Their arrangers, namely the MZ-X300/500, are really good but because of their name, aren't as well known. They still need to overcome their branding from the past.

I plan on getting some Behringer synth stuff in the future. I would LOVE to have the MonoPoly, Deepmind-12 and a couple others. My most recent new gear purchase was the Korg Minilogue XD, however, and I think that Korg has it right. I may even get the Minilogue XD Module to go with it for 8 voices of polyhony.

If Behringer does anything, maybe it will be to wake up the other companies to actually release stuff at more affordable prices that people want. Even though the big three are in a good position, they could be in a better one.

One thing I hope is that we can really break past the 4-voice analog barrier and makes the synths more viable than just bleeps and blips and other noises that some market them for. The Behringer Deepmind-12, Korg Prologue 8/16 are the only ones that I Know of that offer enough polyphony to actually make a difference in playing pad sounds.

Grace,
Harry


Strong points, Harry. Good one.

I think, as a reasonable person, give co's a 2nd chance, esp. if the product
flub was 15-20 yrs ago.

The info on Behringer, is solid. Products should be fairly reviewed.
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Jan1
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Joined: 16 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Behringer recently began working on a DAW which will be available for free.
The aim is to create hardware which will integrate with this DAW seamlessly, and that was reason for Behringer to assemble a team which will specialize in DJ and Music Production gear, the same way as he assembled a team for analog synths.

Putting one and one together I foresee (among other things) something along the lines of an Akai MPC, which also has its own DAW both for use on a computer and in a standalone hardware MPC.
This MPC is a sampling workstation in a drumpad format, and it would not be too hard to create a keybased version of it.
A workstation is not something put together in a matter of weeks or months, it will take some time.

I don't think Behringer should be dismissed as inferior beforehand simply because the company does not have decades of experience in building a workstation.
Behringer already works together with smaller companies for the creation of analog synths, I don't think they will stop doing that when it comes to digital synths.

We're not talking about revival of old hardware, Behringer will have to come up with new hardware, and considering the scope of the project I will be very interested in seeing what Behringer will bring to the table and the price of this hardware, since Behringer has their own way of calculating the price of a product.
I think in a few years the other companies will face serious competition on all fronts, and they will be forced to come up with something unique and worthwhile.
Competition is not necessarily negative, just look at the current struggle between AMD and Intel and how suddenly processors are made with a lot more horsepower than during the previous decade.
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GregC
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Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 9451
Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)

PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jan1 wrote:
Behringer recently began working on a DAW which will be available for free.
The aim is to create hardware which will integrate with this DAW seamlessly, and that was reason for Behringer to assemble a team which will specialize in DJ and Music Production gear, the same way as he assembled a team for analog synths.

Putting one and one together I foresee (among other things) something along the lines of an Akai MPC, which also has its own DAW both for use on a computer and in a standalone hardware MPC.
This MPC is a sampling workstation in a drumpad format, and it would not be too hard to create a keybased version of it.
A workstation is not something put together in a matter of weeks or months, it will take some time.

I don't think Behringer should be dismissed as inferior beforehand simply because the company does not have decades of experience in building a workstation.
Behringer already works together with smaller companies for the creation of analog synths, I don't think they will stop doing that when it comes to digital synths.

We're not talking about revival of old hardware, Behringer will have to come up with new hardware, and considering the scope of the project I will be very interested in seeing what Behringer will bring to the table and the price of this hardware, since Behringer has their own way of calculating the price of a product.
I think in a few years the other companies will face serious competition on all fronts, and they will be forced to come up with something unique and worthwhile.
Competition is not necessarily negative, just look at the current struggle between AMD and Intel and how suddenly processors are made with a lot more horsepower than during the previous decade.


I also respect Behringer. While I don't own any of their gear I regard their product success as an example of why they should be taken seriously in other product niches.

Its interesting,, on another long time keyboard forum , many are thumbs down on Behringer and they dismiss them co as potential competition to the 3 Big Dogs.

Its easy to love what the 3 Big Dogs do, and they have decades of track record.

But there high end products are over priced and that tempers my " love " for them.

I like competition and welcome it. IMO, its about time.
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