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Restart again with OS 3.1
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korg1
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course i agree too with Antony about Sets. Style or sound development just for one style or program might need 1-4 full days of work if you start from scratch. I don't know anyone who would offer his work for less than 5-8$ per hour,so the minimum price for a style or sound should be about 20-25$ .All those free sets are just stolen ones,most of them sharing the same stolen or free internet sounds.
In many cases these sets contain parts of different stolen sets, and usually they are changed in a bad way,that reminds nothing from the original styles,or they sound simply bad because sounds are missing or using the wrong ones.

But samples is not responsible for the restart issues,nor bad styles in my opinion.
Antony might be right about v2 original resources.I did today what he suggested, format the keyboard--->Load v2 Os (2.,4Gb)--->Update to 2.2 (just to be sure)-->Update toV3.1.

I tried to load some songbook entries like last time,and i had no restarts....of course i delete them,didn't need them anyway,just trying to see what might cause a restart problem.

So far,so good for me,thanx Antony,i hope i will never have to deal with that restart problem again
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Aripearlmusic
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Average price per sound/style is usually based on whether the programmer runs a studio full time in which case it would be about the same price as the studio time it took to make and the headache involved in helping the customer load it. Most of the good programmers have a minimum price and amount of sounds/styles to be worth their time dealing with it because its the same headache every time if you're loading 1 sound/style or 100 of them.
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AntonySharmman
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

worth wrote:
so has to do the proper thorough checks that his products don’t cause problems for his customers.

Believe it or not , I never check resources under this perspective , I indeed have found errors in my revises but never have to do
with wrong programming in code level in Pa4X , for the simple reason that this is impossible when you create Styles/Sounds/KBD
sets from scratch in Pa4X
, that's the rule of a successful SET in every PaSeries that nobody does , especially sellers of resources !
I had never a single issue in all PaSeries commercial resources for over 12 years since all were created & saved under the same Pa
model , this is the commonly known "secret".

But we always get of what we've paid for ! Wink
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Korghelper
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of these calculations about style or set price seems to assume you are only going to sell one copy!

Actually, the price you can set for anything and still cover your costs and a decent return for your time involves how many sales you anticipate...

But here is the big problem... until Korg make it easier to copy protect your work, the harder it is to know what percentage of sales you are losing to piracy (or as most players would euphemistically say, ‘style sharing’!) and the harder it is to set a price based on anticipated sales.

Arrangers are mostly a content delivery system. Only a tiny fraction of users create any content at all, and most that is created by users is woefully short of professional standards.

Korg’s lack of an affordable copy protection scheme is strangling creativity and choice for the consumer. I think they need to come up with some type of system like Yamaha have, but then open a ‘marketplace’ for users to post their product and have Korg distribute it and take a commission. I know they already have an approved merchant system with protected memory cards, but it is unwieldy and expensive.

But something along the lines of the Apple Store, secure content delivery to encrypted memory (you would be allowed to edit, but not export from the encrypted memory section) open to all users, with a sales numbers and ratings system to help the best creators rise to the top, this might create an explosion of new content, with the best creators finally able to get a decent return on their time and talent, free of the drag of piracy on their income.

Korg should seriously consider this... If you manufacture a content delivery system (the arranger) you should bend over backwards to provide a safe place for those creating the content that drives the sales of your hardware!
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is not the place or time to talk about it,but i will give you an example just to make sure we are talking about the same thing.

Quote:
Most of these calculations about style or set price seems to assume you are only going to sell one copy!


I am sure that you already know that whoever you ask at a studio, to build for you just a midi file of a song , from scratch,he will ask you about 100$ .
And this is 3times less the work that has to be done for a style.

So,for someone selling 15$or 20$ his 3-4 days' of work is really cheap,while he should sell it for 200 or 300.

Everybody can save his 15-20$ by building his own styles,for those who believe that building a specific style is that easy,or they can just use an mp3 version of the song for 3$.
There are solutions for everyone.
Personally i think that even if mp3's are great,style always sounds live,more aggressive and you can use it at any key,tempo,or bar you want.

So far,no restart issues after formating KORG DISK and load Os2.00 (2.4Gb) resources before updating to 3.1
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bespoke style creation is one thing, but that’s not how it used to work. Think back to the early days of third party style creation, before piracy became rampant, and style creators would take it on themselves to create non-specific styles of ROM quality in different genres, and sell them independently.

Your figures seem to be based on the style creator selling 10-15 copies to make the same as if he did bespoke for one person. When tens of thousands of the arrangers have been sold!

Without a protected marketplace, that might be all he can get before it gets traded and given out into the wild (if even that). It’s possible you don’t remember the third party scene from the early days, but before broadband and easy file sharing, there were a LOT of very good style creators in business. Now there are not. I’d like to see Korg help bring those days back.

Yes, this might not be the place (admin, feel free to split these posts off to another thread) but despite specific song backing being available in a variety of formats, it’s the more generic or non-specific styles that help you create your own style and sound and high quality ones of those are few and far between! Those were the main thing back before bespoke style making became the only way for a talented stylist to make money...

And I’m glad to see the reformat help with the restarts. Have you contacted Korg with the information? Perhaps they should include these steps in their upgrade instructions?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Charging too little for set decreases its value to the one who is purchasing it making it less likely that they will protect your work. Making a set with the maximum RAM is a good way to keep people from copying your set because it could take several minutes for them to save your set. Also by not using traditional key mapping modifying the factory resources to either change the sounds or the order of the sounds you can make it a 6 step process to save and load your set. Charging too much for low quality work also makes it more likely that people will copy because they can hear its true value.
My smallest sound packs start at $400 and i dont sell individual sounds or styles because that puts a price per style vs per hour/day of work. Nobody has my set who didnt pay
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korg1
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aripearlmusic , i have a set with over 1700 titles of high quality styles,unfortunately not English titles ones,but even 2euro per style would be way too much for someone to buy it,right ?

Mapping in your own mapping,is a good way for keeping away many of those who want to access your work for free,but i prefer a standard mapping,so i can easily change later to a superior3 vst drumkit for example,or similar,without having to re map every single cv of every style.

Generally,i create styles for my personal needs,and then i sell them at a affordable price for those who also need them.

But i also create custom styles for customers by demand ,starting price from 150-200 euros,and usually these styles are either hard to be created or they don't exist in the market,not even as midifiles.
There are many times when i advice them not to spend money for songs that ain't worthy for!!!!

Korghelper, no i haven't contact Korg, cause i want to see if there are gonna be any restart issues or not.
I suppose if there are none within one or two months,it means factory resources had been destroyed somehow on the Os' update way up to 3.1 and that was causing the problem.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2019 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have yet to need more than 30 styles for any gig including song styles for 9 hours of music playing over 200 songs
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karmathanever
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I have yet to need more than 30 styles for any gig including song styles for 9 hours of music playing over 200 songs

So the 1200+ professionally created styles that Korg have given us should suit you (and me Wink ) just fine
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do jewish music so a few of the ballads and bossa beats are about the only factory styles i use the rest is completely my own sounds and styles
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korg1
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have quite Hebrew customers,and this kind of songs are usually not common to other countries.
For that reason they are custom orders .
quite many are interesting,they use different patterns and tutties all the time,and that makes it even harder to make a style.
Here is an example :
https://drive.google.com/file/d/199pVxsr-K4etfAI8GckRcNlDq86_x8KC/view?usp=sharing
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sell a few at $400 a set, or sell thousands at $10 a set. That's the difference protected memory gets you.

Once the memory is protected, whoever buys it whether they value it or not is incapable of sharing it.

I don't think you are seeing the big picture. Protected memory allows you to price styles and sample sets at prices that anyone can afford without thinking twice about it. This is the Apple Store model, and seems to work quite well for them!

Sure, if you make a niche product like Jewish sounds and styles, maybe you are better off the way things are. But this rather smacks of simply trying to get money for work you have already done for yourself (no harm in that, mind you!). But if you have the talent to make a set of klezmer sounds and styles, you probably have the talent to make a set of orchestral, or jazz, or rock sounds and styles. With a MUCH wider appeal. But you're not going to sell many at $400 a pop! Especially when VSTi's that access FAR more RAM can be had for less.

A copy protected marketplace allows you to price your work where the majority can afford it. Think big! Cool
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unfortunately there is never gonna be a lock for styles guys,
and it's easy for everyone to think why.


In the meantime,i had a new restart...
This time no sounds or style involved.
I was trying to create a songbook entry using a new mp3 file ,
something i have done a lot of times before without any problem.

Before that i was in edit SETLIST mode,moving songs around a bit ,and when i need the new title, i created it but wheni presed WRITE ,the jkeyboard restarted.

When opened again,the new entry was successfully written in songbook though.

P.S usb cable was connected to pa4x ,i suspect that could cause the conflict too
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Haha no just the smaller sound packs are $400 but i sample VSTs after designing my own patches in them and yeah plugins can be cheaper but the good plugins are much closer to 1000 and some are more than 3 times that. My competitors are charging easily 5 times what i am so I'm comfortable selling a full set for 2500. Ive tried charging less and i actually got more customers when i raised my prices. $10 a beat is a joke to the point that i know just from the price thats it's not professional. It shows a lack of value and respect of one's work to charge so little. I also fill up the sound banks and RAM so my full set cannot be merged with any other set to prevent issues from other people's work. More than 50 players have bought the smaller sound packs and the next size up. Selling for cheaper than that would make it a side job with full time hours. I didnt quit gigging to have to take a day job to pay the bills.
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