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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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 Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:11 am Post subject: Kronos suddenly not booting up |
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Hi Folks,
I've been trawling through the forum looking for answers but so far cannot find anything on the problem I have!
After 3 years of sitting in my home studio & not being gigged Kronos won't boot up.
It starts as normal & the load screen comes on but after a few seconds the fan noise stops and shortly afterwards the screen goes blank.
It's not always the same, in fact at one point it went all the way through the boot stage but died just after the main page came up.
If anyone has any answers to this, or indeed have any links in the forum that I could go to I would be most grateful.
Fortunately I have other gear I use for gigs and another weighted board replacing the Kronos (which I am about to have a look inside of to check the connections).
This is the first problem I've had with Kronos - I have used it every day as part of my studio setup (linked to the PC) It is usually on for around 6 or 7 hours a day.
So this unit is a late version 'one', on the cusp of the move to Kronos X - two hard drives and memory maxed out. Plus the sounds upgrade that not quite makes it a K2.
Many thanks in anticipation for any help that you folks in Korgland can give me.
Regards
Jeff
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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GregC
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 9451
Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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I have the same model, mine is 8 yrs old.
If you googled the forum, you should find several posts on the issue- you could make a list of 10 possibilities, so its trial and error time.
Tell us exactly about your power connections at home and if you have midi/USB connections.
Anyway, based on your report, the fan is suspicious- if the fan dies your K will not boot up. Spending money on trial and error DIY is far down the list IMO. Other non cash steps should be done
_________________
Kronos 88. MODX8
Achieve your musical dreams 
https://soundcloud.com/user-898236994 |
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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| GregC wrote: | I have the same model, mine is 8 yrs old.
If you googled the forum, you should find several posts on the issue- you could make a list of 10 possibilities, so its trial and error time.
Tell us exactly about your power connections at home and if you have midi/USB connections.
Anyway, based on your report, the fan is suspicious- if the fan dies your K will not boot up. Spending money on trial and error DIY is far down the list IMO. Other non cash steps should be done |
Thanks for responding GregC.
In in the UK - Mains power 240 volts standard-no issues as far as I know - house was rewired about 12 years ago. I also have a spike protector before all the computer stuff.
I had USB going to the pc continually connected and a USB dongle going in, which is for a remote Alpa Numeric device for quicker input when needed.
When the problem started yesterday I disconnected both USBs and tried again with similar results.
I actually cannot remember if the fan stays on permanently (it's very quiet) - Should it cut in and out according to the temperature or should it stay on?
I have already done a little investigation. Took the back (bottom) off and checked all the connectors, the SS drives and the RAM. The fan looked ok - not much dust. Everything else seems in order. No loose screws. It's not been gigged so has had an easy-ish life, although it is 'On' 6 or 7 hours every day. After that -- same result.
My first thoughts were that the main boot drive might have failed but isn't that rather rare for a solid state drive?
Not sure what else I can tell you. I get no 'message', the screen just goes blank usually a matter of seconds after the 'loading bar' starts.
I'll have another try at googling as you suggest!
Kind regards
Jeff
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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GregC
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 9451
Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| jeffjazzwraight wrote: | | GregC wrote: | I have the same model, mine is 8 yrs old.
If you googled the forum, you should find several posts on the issue- you could make a list of 10 possibilities, so its trial and error time.
Tell us exactly about your power connections at home and if you have midi/USB connections.
Anyway, based on your report, the fan is suspicious- if the fan dies your K will not boot up. Spending money on trial and error DIY is far down the list IMO. Other non cash steps should be done |
Thanks for responding GregC.
In in the UK - Mains power 240 volts standard-no issues as far as I know - house was rewired about 12 years ago. I also have a spike protector before all the computer stuff.
I had USB going to the pc continually connected and a USB dongle going in, which is for a remote Alpa Numeric device for quicker input when needed.
When the problem started yesterday I disconnected both USBs and tried again with similar results.
I actually cannot remember if the fan stays on permanently (it's very quiet) - Should it cut in and out according to the temperature or should it stay on?
I have already done a little investigation. Took the back (bottom) off and checked all the connectors, the SS drives and the RAM. The fan looked ok - not much dust. Everything else seems in order. No loose screws. It's not been gigged so has had an easy-ish life, although it is 'On' 6 or 7 hours every day. After that -- same result.
My first thoughts were that the main boot drive might have failed but isn't that rather rare for a solid state drive?
Not sure what else I can tell you. I get no 'message', the screen just goes blank usually a matter of seconds after the 'loading bar' starts.
I'll have another try at googling as you suggest!
Kind regards
Jeff |
Glad to help, Jeff. I would approach it just like you.
a simple step- reseat all you Ac/main power plugs. So its firmly seated.
The fan is automatic. Turns on with small noise during boot up and goes to whisper/quiet mode. I think this is the way it works- maybe other folks can chime in.
I have the original fan. Some owners did not like the factory choice of fan- there are 'better ' fans. My attitude is if its not broke, don't fix it.
The problem , as I see it , with 6-7 hours of power up per day is the possibility of surges. I see you have a spike protector- these can vary in quality.
As far as useful life of components, an SSD failure is a possible.
But this is 1 of several 'maybe's'. After 8 years, I have not noticed any
common component life span failure. especially since your K is kept in the
studio.
I would reseat the 240 pin RAM. And re-attach your SATA cables.
After all that, we are looking at the PSU, internal power supply. Again, this is trial and error, guess work. When you reach this point, i am inclined to recommend your local service. You can shock yourself by working on the PSU.
_________________
Kronos 88. MODX8
Achieve your musical dreams
https://soundcloud.com/user-898236994 |
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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks again Greg
I've been in touch with Korg. Taking the unit to their factory in Milton Keynes tomorrow. Nice 2-3 hour drive each way.
I'll post here with any news and what was wrong in due course.
Best wishes
Jeff
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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Derek Cook
Approved Merchant
Joined: 20 Jul 2014
Posts: 1279
Location: Wales, UK
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hi,
You have done all that I would do before deciding it probably needs pro help.
It might just be the law of averages of course. All hardware components have a failure probability, and operation without failure is not guaranteed. We are lucky to be in age where modern manufacturing techniques have made things so reliable it is a shock when they fail. E.g. I have a Behinger Line mixer in a gig rack that is 13 years old and going strong. But I had one fail the other day at about the three year mark.
Slightly OT, but it staggers me how reliable complex chips like microprocessors are. A 70s micro had less than 5,000 transistors in it; a modern "average" Intel micro has around 2 billion of the little blighters (all on a chip area the size of your thumbnail). Some NVIDIA "systems on a chip" are hitting the 9billion mark.
Do let us know how you get on, and what the problem was. Always worth knowing the cause and also the service provided by Korg.
_________________
Derek Cook - Java Developer
Follow kronos.factory development and submit ideas over at the kronos.factory Trello Board
My Echoes Music Website
My Carreg Ddu Music Website |
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pedro5
Platinum Member
Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 1150
Location: Coventry UK.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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Pleased to learn you’re visiting Korg UK to find a solution to the problem.
I’ve had excellent service from them in the past.
They will indeed be obliging and are likely to remedy the cause etc.
Do report back with the findings.
Best Wishes. |
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DeltaJockey
Senior Member
Joined: 27 Jul 2015
Posts: 303
Location: East Gippsland, Australia
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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I'm surprised in all your discussion that nobody has suggested a power supply problem. From what you've described, particularly the blank screen, and the variable time to failure, this sounds like a power supply issue to me. In any case, if it is, you've taken the right steps to get Korg to check it out, it would be just a matter of swapping over the switch mode power supply, and you'd be good to go.
good luck
_________________
The companions I can't live without: Kawai Acoustic Grand, Kawai MP11SE, Yamaha Montage8, Korg D1
Other important stuff: Kronos2-73, Studiologic NC2X, NI Komplete Ultimate 11, Sonuscore Elysion and Orchestra, Pianoteq, Experimenta Due. |
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DeltaJockey
Senior Member
Joined: 27 Jul 2015
Posts: 303
Location: East Gippsland, Australia
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| GregC wrote: |
After all that, we are looking at the PSU, internal power supply. |
Sorry Greg, I missed your comment in all the chatter.
_________________
The companions I can't live without: Kawai Acoustic Grand, Kawai MP11SE, Yamaha Montage8, Korg D1
Other important stuff: Kronos2-73, Studiologic NC2X, NI Komplete Ultimate 11, Sonuscore Elysion and Orchestra, Pianoteq, Experimenta Due. |
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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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| Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:20 am Post subject: |
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Hi folks,
Thanks for all your comments.
Yes - A Power Supply problem did come up in my mind too! Anyway I'm up before the larks hoping to miss Rush Hour around the west part of the M25 (I'm based near Brighton). At 65 I no longer do so many long trips! lol!
Only problem is that I'm gonna have to leave Kronos with Korg, then do another trip to pick it up. (Still better than using a carrier where the unit could be damaged - and less expensive).
So, the stick is loaded with plenty of jazz - I'm good to go.
I'll post my 'KorgRepairExperience' in due course.
Best wishes y'all
Jeff
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 7:44 am Post subject: |
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Well my sick Kronos is with Korg in Milton Keynes. Very helpful blokes at the large warehouse at rear of the office building.
They will contact me after they get through the 'exploration'. They have 10 units under warrenty to do before they get to mine. (Fair enough!) I missed out on the 3 year extended warrenty by 3 months. Typical!! lol!!
At 60 quid an hour I asked for a 'Ballpark' idea of how long average repairs take. Apparently most repairs are completed within the hour. Encouraging!
Worst bit was the M25 which was chokker even at 7.15 am when I joined it near Leatherhead.
More news as & when!
BW
Jeff
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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Derek Cook
Approved Merchant
Joined: 20 Jul 2014
Posts: 1279
Location: Wales, UK
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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Good luck! Yeah, every time I have been up early to try and beat the M25, I realise that you can't beat it. I've left Seven Oaks area at 0530 before to get to Fleet area and still been stuck in queues!
Do let us know what the problem was when it is fixed
_________________
Derek Cook - Java Developer
Follow kronos.factory development and submit ideas over at the kronos.factory Trello Board
My Echoes Music Website
My Carreg Ddu Music Website |
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pedro5
Platinum Member
Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 1150
Location: Coventry UK.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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If you took the Kronos in its original packaging….ie cardboard carton plus internal polystyrene blocks etc.
Depending on cost, it may be worth considering its return by courrier delivery, Korg UK can arrange this for you routinely.
My Kronos 73 has been to Milton Keys via a courier several times in the past and although the cardboard carton suffered cuts & scrapes,even some holes, the keyboard remained intact.
Korg UK provided a collection/repair and return turnaround within less than one week,collected on a Monday and returned on Friday, all covered by warranty luckily,in my case.
I dread to think how much it would have cost, otherwise.
Although the workshop teckies can sometimes make mistakes,propably in haste due to workload etc....otherwise, they will offer good service.
The support dept were excellent with me throughout.
Best Wishes. |
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jeffjazzwraight
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:49 am Post subject: |
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Thanx for further messages.
Certainly will let you all know what the problem was.
Packaging long gone. I bought a soft flightcase shortly after getting the Kronos - Used it for the first time Tuesday.
Korg charge £48 plus VAT for courier delivery, and the chap at the warehouse said they would package it all up. I just don't fancy the chances of such a big & heavy unit (it's an 88 ) making it thru the postal system. I'm semi retired so have plenty of time to do the journey. I might even do the scenic route via A34 & Oxford when Kronos is fixed just for a change. Oh nearly forgot - I used not much more than 25 quid's worth of fuel for the 250 ish mile trip from Worthing area.
More on the saga as and when!
BW
J
_________________
Kronos 88 v3.1.3-Upgraded & Maxed out to 3gb. Nord Stage 2 88HD. Roland Jupiter 80. Waldorf Blofeld Keys. Korg TR. Yamaha S80. Yamaha DX7 special edition. PC-Windows 10 64bit 16gig Ram. M Audio Delta 1010lt. Cubase Pro 10. Sibelius Ultimate, NI Komplete Ultimate 11. Trillion. Lounge Lizard. Wavelab. |
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pedro5
Platinum Member
Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 1150
Location: Coventry UK.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:56 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the update.
Self collection costs(fuel etc) appear to be cheaper than the courier charges, at a hefty £48 plus, so a drive around the Oxford area will be interesting, even if the whole trip would be over 250 miles….phew.
UK roads are not the best for “touring” though….lol.
However,you already know what's involved and probably the next journey will be enjoyable.
We wait with bated breath for a successful outcome.
Best Wishes. |
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