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USB connection for monitoring and recording

 
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:42 am    Post subject: USB connection for monitoring and recording Reply with quote

Hi guys I couldn’t find anything in the manual so my last resort is this forum.
I am using my korg Kronos as an audio interface. I record voice coming from an external preamp into the audio input of the korg, apply compressor and send it to my DAW( video editing software) .
In the video editing app I have a background music which I want to hear as a reference through my headphones ( connected to the Korg’s headphone jack)
I have create a mix-BUS in my video app and sent the Music through USB to the korg. All swell.
But now when I record into my video app, it records everything I hear from the headphone jack. How can I exclude the music from being sent back through USB?
Thanks

Vivi
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kronoSphere
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Joined: 04 Jan 2012
Posts: 696

PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello,
I really don't understand why you connect your headphones to the Kronos (?)
I would connect it to the DAW
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kronoSphere wrote:
Hello,
I really don't understand why you connect your headphones to the Kronos (?)
I would connect it to the DAW



Thanks for the reply. Yes I know I should connect it to the DAW ( video editing software) I just don’t know how I can monitor there. I get a signal in my input but I can hear it.

I know how it’s done in a DAW but not sure if a video editor also has monitoring.
Will look into it.
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kronoSphere wrote:
Hello,
I really don't understand why you connect your headphones to the Kronos (?)
I would connect it to the DAW


Looks like ASIO is required for input monitoring to work.
Let’s see if it works with the Korg.
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kronoSphere wrote:
Hello,
I really don't understand why you connect your headphones to the Kronos (?)
I would connect it to the DAW


Ok so here is the situation.
I am using the Korg as the audio interface. That’s why I used the headphone output there in the first place.
If I want to connect my headphones to the DAW I need to use another USB interface ( which is basically a USB mic with headphone jack. )
I know it’s terrible but it’s all I have here till I researched the best solution.
In order to have input monitoring I need to install ASIO4ALL. But no matter what settings I try the performance is terrible. Not sure if it’s the video Program. Even if I get the latency to a decent place, I can’t play the video smoothly and record. Again I have tried a variety of recommend settings.
Could also be that I have to select both, the Korg and the USB mic in the ASIO. Maybe it’s too much?
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ChrisDuncan
Senior Member


Joined: 17 May 2018
Posts: 389

PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, Vivi.

Let's take it back a couple of steps and identify a few things, which will help me and others be able to better help you.

1. Which DAW (Logic, Cubase, ...?)
2. Which video editing software (Final Cut, Premiere, Resolve...?)
3. Mac or PC and what OS version (Windows 7, Windows 10, Catalina, Mojave, ..?)

Also, is the end result you're trying to create a video that includes music? If not, what are you wanting to accomplish?

If you can fill me in on these things I'll do my best to help.
_________________
Studio: Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Yamaha TF5 | Mackie MCU | CMC AI, QC
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Fantom 7 | JV 2080 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChrisDuncan wrote:
Hi, Vivi.

Let's take it back a couple of steps and identify a few things, which will help me and others be able to better help you.

1. Which DAW (Logic, Cubase, ...?)
2. Which video editing software (Final Cut, Premiere, Resolve...?)
3. Mac or PC and what OS version (Windows 7, Windows 10, Catalina, Mojave, ..?)

Also, is the end result you're trying to create a video that includes music? If not, what are you wanting to accomplish?

If you can fill me in on these things I'll do my best to help.



Hi,
Thanks for your kindness.

My DAW is actually Vegas Video. I have Resolve as the main editing software but this software feels very incomplete in terms of a DAW. Also I get bad latency and there are no settings I can tweak. When I used ASIO4ALL I used the same settings in Vegas , FLStudio and Resolve. FLStudio had by far the best result in terms of latency, usability and smoothness. Resolve is a disaster. I even tried my RME Fireface ASIO in resolve with not bad performance but it didn’t even show all input. Just one single input.
To clarify why I don’t use FLStudio, it’s because track based recording is not FLStudio’s thing. I really love the smoothness of FL and that it has an audio editor. But I need track based recording Feature.
Which lead me to give Reaper a try and it’s the champ so far.
But the reason I want to use Vegas with the Korg is the possibility to add text to my video which I can use a reference for my voiceover. I can adjust the timing of the text perfectly. However since trying Reaper I don’t want to look back anymore Smile
Another good thing about my ASIO4ALL setup was that I had basically 3 interfaces hooked up, the Korg via USB, the YetiMic via USB and a Blackmagic decklink monitor card.
I would assign the speakers to the decklink card and the recording monitoring to the yeti headphones. So when recording I would only hear through my headphones but as soon as I replay it would play through my speakers, all automatically. No mute buttons necessary. Really liked that.

To get back to your questions, the music is on a separate track which will be my background music. I use auto ducking on it as well. Sometimes I just talk, sometimes I sing to the music creating several voice layers. Sort of like a musical. So of course I want to listen to everything previously recorded. Music, and singing voices.
The problem with the korg though is that it seems that there is no way for audio coming in from an input, to be excluded from the “return via USB” signal.
Basically all sound goes inevitably through USB. As far as I know the only way to split output signal is by actually using the TRS outputs 1/2 3/4.
But for that I would need to use my RME which has enough inputs and routing possibilities.
That being said I currently use the RME only as have to finish This project and the quality of the RME preamps is just really awesome.
A lot going on here I know Smile

I am on Windows 10.
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChrisDuncan wrote:
Hi, Vivi.

Let's take it back a couple of steps and identify a few things, which will help me and others be able to better help you.

1. Which DAW (Logic, Cubase, ...?)
2. Which video editing software (Final Cut, Premiere, Resolve...?)
3. Mac or PC and what OS version (Windows 7, Windows 10, Catalina, Mojave, ..?)

Also, is the end result you're trying to create a video that includes music? If not, what are you wanting to accomplish?

If you can fill me in on these things I'll do my best to help.



Hi,
Thanks for your kindness.

My DAW is actually Vegas Video. I have Resolve as the main editing software but this software feels very incomplete in terms of a DAW. Also I get bad latency and there are no settings I can tweak. When I used ASIO4ALL I used the same settings in Vegas , FLStudio and Resolve. FLStudio had by far the best result in terms of latency, usability and smoothness. Resolve is a disaster. I even tried my RME Fireface ASIO in resolve with not bad performance but it didn’t even show all input. Just one single input.
To clarify why I don’t use FLStudio, it’s because track based recording is not FLStudio’s thing. I really love the smoothness of FL and that it has an audio editor. But I need track based recording Feature.
Which lead me to give Reaper a try and it’s the champ so far.
But the reason I want to use Vegas with the Korg is the possibility to add text to my video which I can use a reference for my voiceover. I can adjust the timing of the text perfectly. However since trying Reaper I don’t want to look back anymore Smile
Another good thing about my ASIO4ALL setup was that I had basically 3 interfaces hooked up, the Korg via USB, the YetiMic via USB and a Blackmagic decklink monitor card.
I would assign the speakers to the decklink card and the recording monitoring to the yeti headphones. So when recording I would only hear through my headphones but as soon as I replay it would play through my speakers, all automatically. No mute buttons necessary. Really liked that.

To get back to your questions, the music is on a separate track which will be my background music. I use auto ducking on it as well. Sometimes I just talk, sometimes I sing to the music creating several voice layers. Sort of like a musical. So of course I want to listen to everything previously recorded. Music, and singing voices.
The problem with the korg though is that it seems that there is no way for audio coming in from an input, to be excluded from the “return via USB” signal.
Basically all sound goes inevitably through USB. As far as I know the only way to split output signal is by actually using the TRS outputs 1/2 3/4.
But for that I would need to use my RME which has enough inputs and routing possibilities.
That being said I currently use the RME only as have to finish This project and the quality of the RME preamps is just really awesome.
A lot going on here I know Smile

I am on Windows 10.
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ChrisDuncan
Senior Member


Joined: 17 May 2018
Posts: 389

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vivi wrote:

Hi,
Thanks for your kindness.

My DAW is actually Vegas Video. I have Resolve as the main editing software but this software feels very incomplete in terms of a DAW. Also I get bad latency and there are no settings I can tweak. When I used ASIO4ALL I used the same settings in Vegas , FLStudio and Resolve. FLStudio had by far the best result in terms of latency, usability and smoothness. Resolve is a disaster. I even tried my RME Fireface ASIO in resolve with not bad performance but it didn’t even show all input. Just one single input.
To clarify why I don’t use FLStudio, it’s because track based recording is not FLStudio’s thing. I really love the smoothness of FL and that it has an audio editor. But I need track based recording Feature.
Which lead me to give Reaper a try and it’s the champ so far.
But the reason I want to use Vegas with the Korg is the possibility to add text to my video which I can use a reference for my voiceover. I can adjust the timing of the text perfectly. However since trying Reaper I don’t want to look back anymore Smile
Another good thing about my ASIO4ALL setup was that I had basically 3 interfaces hooked up, the Korg via USB, the YetiMic via USB and a Blackmagic decklink monitor card.
I would assign the speakers to the decklink card and the recording monitoring to the yeti headphones. So when recording I would only hear through my headphones but as soon as I replay it would play through my speakers, all automatically. No mute buttons necessary. Really liked that.

To get back to your questions, the music is on a separate track which will be my background music. I use auto ducking on it as well. Sometimes I just talk, sometimes I sing to the music creating several voice layers. Sort of like a musical. So of course I want to listen to everything previously recorded. Music, and singing voices.
The problem with the korg though is that it seems that there is no way for audio coming in from an input, to be excluded from the “return via USB” signal.
Basically all sound goes inevitably through USB. As far as I know the only way to split output signal is by actually using the TRS outputs 1/2 3/4.
But for that I would need to use my RME which has enough inputs and routing possibilities.
That being said I currently use the RME only as have to finish This project and the quality of the RME preamps is just really awesome.
A lot going on here I know Smile

I am on Windows 10.

I'm going to recommend some changes to your workflow. It'll take a little getting used to, but I think in the end you'll find it much easier to accomplish your goals.

The general theme will be using the best tool for the job. I used Vegas ages ago and currently use Resolve on a regular basis, but just for video. The titles and everything else you want to do is all there in Resolve. For audio, I use Cubase but a close friend uses Reaper and I think that's a solid choice for audio.

Regarding audio interfaces, RME has had an outstanding reputation for quality since the 90s. You don't mention which Fireface you have (there are multiple versions), but of all your interface options, this would be the one I used. RME should have its own drivers, so there shouldn't be a need to use ASIO4ALL. The fewer moving parts you have, the fewer things that can introduce problems.

I have no experience with Yeti or other USB mics, but I'm assuming they show up in Reaper as an input choice to record from. For the Kronos, I would plug the stereo outs into the RME. You should be able to monitor via your headphones on the RME, and / or any speakers you have connected to it. As a comparable example, on my keyboard workstation I use a Steinberg UR22. The Kronos stereo outs go to the two inputs. All Cubase tracks go to the UR22 for playback. I have a pair of powered Mackie monitors connected to the outputs, and hear the Cubase tracks and the Kronos.

As for using the best tool for the job, I would record audio to Reaper and video to Resolve. If you can add audio tracks to Vegas you could use it as well, but it's worth taking the time to get comfortable with Resolve as it's much, much more capable than Vegas for video.

Whichever you choose, drag your audio final mix that you did in Reaper into the video editing software. Don't try to do audio recording or editing in a video app. If you want to change the audio, go back to Reaper, export, then import the new audio mix to the video app. You'll have to manually line it up to the video. If you've recorded yourself singing on the video, you should be able to compare the waveforms visually. Alternatively, if you record yourself clapping your hands once in front of the camera at the beginning of your video, you can easily align the audio peak to when your hands come together. Just move one frame at a time until the moment they start moving apart again. Then slide the audio until the very peak of the handclap sound lines up with the frame before they start moving apart.

I believe much of your frustration comes from trying to use tools in areas where they're not strong. I would not record or mix audio in Vegas or Resolve. That's Reaper's area. I'd eliminate all but one audio interface, and the RME is the best quality of the lot. Use the stereo out from the Korg into your RME. You may indeed be able to get audio via USB, but the audio outs are the most straightforward (and reliable) method.

While I use Cubase and the UR22 on the keyboard workstation, that's essentially the workflow I follow and it's reliable and easy to use once set up. If I'm doing something with audio, I reach for the DAW (Cubase). If I'm doing something visual, I reach for the video software (Resolve). For final output of the video, I import the audio and do the video editing and rendering in Resolve, because the output is a video (I use the Vimeo preset, one click and gives me exactly what I need).

As you doubtless know by now, with all the moving parts at your disposal there are a ton of different ways you can do things. Mine is not the only "right" way, but I've been fooling around with recording since the 70s and doing video for the past 20 years. I'm certainly no expert, but I think you'll find this workflow one that will allow you to focus on creativity instead of losing hours or days in Techie Hell. I've done lots of that, which is how I ended up with my current approach. Smile

Hope this helps.
_________________
Studio: Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Yamaha TF5 | Mackie MCU | CMC AI, QC
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Fantom 7 | JV 2080 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2020 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:


I'm going to recommend some changes to your workflow. It'll take a little getting used to, but I think in the end you'll find it much easier to accomplish your goals.

The general theme will be using the best tool for the job. I used Vegas ages ago and currently use Resolve on a regular basis, but just for video. The titles and everything else you want to do is all there in Resolve. For audio, I use Cubase but a close friend uses Reaper and I think that's a solid choice for audio.

Regarding audio interfaces, RME has had an outstanding reputation for quality since the 90s. You don't mention which Fireface you have (there are multiple versions), but of all your interface options, this would be the one I used. RME should have its own drivers, so there shouldn't be a need to use ASIO4ALL. The fewer moving parts you have, the fewer things that can introduce problems.....




What a terrific answer. Thank you for taking so much time.
I have the Fireface400 btw. It’s old but still does a terrific job.
I wish I could get the new RME devices with DSPs but I guess I’ll wait.
Well the idea was to use only Resolve Especially with Fairlight build in. But I guess it will take years till this software will be matured in that regard.
BMD’s main priorities are only features that will produce money i.e features that are integrated with their hardware to drive hardware sales.

It would have been a dream as I could create my motion graphics, edit, audio all in one program. Well but I guess that’s off the table. It makes perfect sense what you are saying. Now that I got the hang of Reaper I don’t want to do the audio in any other program. I am actually impressed how fairly priced this powerful software is. And to my surprise, reaper can create text overlays for the video track. So it is perfect.

For the monitoring part I guess I will need a physical mute button for my speakers for when I want to record and listen through my headphone. I am not in a booth so, recording booth a monitor room are the same.
I saw a volume/mute button online but was kinda pricey. About 80$.

Cheers,

Vivi
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2020 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:


I'm going to recommend some changes to your workflow. It'll take a little getting used to, but I think in the end you'll find it much easier to accomplish your goals.

The general theme will be using the best tool for the job. I used Vegas ages ago and currently use Resolve on a regular basis, but just for video. The titles and everything else you want to do is all there in Resolve. For audio, I use Cubase but a close friend uses Reaper and I think that's a solid choice for audio.

Regarding audio interfaces, RME has had an outstanding reputation for quality since the 90s. You don't mention which Fireface you have (there are multiple versions), but of all your interface options, this would be the one I used. RME should have its own drivers, so there shouldn't be a need to use ASIO4ALL. The fewer moving parts you have, the fewer things that can introduce problems.....




What a terrific answer. Thank you for taking so much time.
I have the Fireface400 btw. It’s old but still does a terrific job.
I wish I could get the new RME devices with DSPs but I guess I’ll wait.
Well the idea was to use only Resolve Especially with Fairlight build in. But I guess it will take years till this software will be matured in that regard.
BMD’s main priorities are only features that will produce money i.e features that are integrated with their hardware to drive hardware sales.

It would have been a dream as I could create my motion graphics, edit, audio all in one program. Well but I guess that’s off the table. It makes perfect sense what you are saying. Now that I got the hang of Reaper I don’t want to do the audio in any other program. I am actually impressed how fairly priced this powerful software is. And to my surprise, reaper can create text overlays for the video track. So it is perfect.

For the monitoring part I guess I will need a physical mute button for my speakers for when I want to record and listen through my headphone. I am not in a booth so, recording booth a monitor room are the same.
I saw a volume/mute button online but was kinda pricey. About 80$.

Cheers,

Vivi
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vivi



Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2020 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:


I'm going to recommend some changes to your workflow. It'll take a little getting used to, but I think in the end you'll find it much easier to accomplish your goals.

The general theme will be using the best tool for the job. I used Vegas ages ago and currently use Resolve on a regular basis, but just for video. The titles and everything else you want to do is all there in Resolve. For audio, I use Cubase but a close friend uses Reaper and I think that's a solid choice for audio.

Regarding audio interfaces, RME has had an outstanding reputation for quality since the 90s. You don't mention which Fireface you have (there are multiple versions), but of all your interface options, this would be the one I used. RME should have its own drivers, so there shouldn't be a need to use ASIO4ALL. The fewer moving parts you have, the fewer things that can introduce problems.....




What a terrific answer. Thank you for taking so much time.
I have the Fireface400 btw. It’s old but still does a terrific job.
I wish I could get the new RME devices with DSPs but I guess I’ll wait.
Well the idea was to use only Resolve Especially with Fairlight build in. But I guess it will take years till this software will be matured in that regard.
BMD’s main priorities are only features that will produce money i.e features that are integrated with their hardware to drive hardware sales.

It would have been a dream as I could create my motion graphics, edit, audio all in one program. Well but I guess that’s off the table. It makes perfect sense what you are saying. Now that I got the hang of Reaper I don’t want to do the audio in any other program. I am actually impressed how fairly priced this powerful software is. And to my surprise, reaper can create text overlays for the video track. So it is perfect.

For the monitoring part I guess I will need a physical mute button for my speakers for when I want to record and listen through my headphone. I am not in a booth so, recording booth a monitor room are the same.
I saw a volume/mute button online but was kinda pricey. About 80$.

Cheers,

Vivi
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