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Bachus Platinum Member
Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 3127
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Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:31 pm Post subject: Juno 106 hits Roland System 8 |
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https://youtu.be/tl9I4moBwFQ
The next plug out from Roland for their aira range...
The idea behind this is ingenious.. |
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Kevin Nolan Approved Merchant
Joined: 04 Dec 2005 Posts: 2524 Location: Dublin, Ireland
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 12:53 am Post subject: |
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It sounds absolutely nothing like a Juno106. Incredibly poor emulation! |
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spaceman3 Platinum Member
Joined: 25 Jan 2015 Posts: 520
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:13 am Post subject: |
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I know im a butthole for saying this,
but if it is possible for a synth to sound not musical and sterile.
This synth gets the prize.
I like the idea behind it.
I just do not like the sound of it.
Perhaps im wrong.
Just my opinion.
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RC-IA Approved Merchant
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 971 Location: FR
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Owned it since several weeks, amazing synth, sound is so good. Concerning juno106 emulation, i don't have a juno right here to compare, and would say i don't care so much, but the so called juno106 in system 8 sounds incredibly on its own (meaning that i not looking at it as a juno emu), so limited and so good in the same way...
This System 8 made me return to roland after decades.... _________________ https://soundcloud.com/rcmusic35
https://www.youtube.com/user/rcmusic35
https://www.barbandco.com/home-e.html |
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EvilDragon Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005 Posts: 1992 Location: Croatia
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:40 am Post subject: |
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TAL did a much better job at emulating the Juno-106. |
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Kevin Nolan Approved Merchant
Joined: 04 Dec 2005 Posts: 2524 Location: Dublin, Ireland
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:43 am Post subject: |
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RC-IA wrote: | Owned it since several weeks, amazing synth, sound is so good. Concerning juno106 emulation, i don't have a juno right here to compare, and would say i don't care so much, but the so called juno106 in system 8 sounds incredibly on its own (meaning that i not looking at it as a juno emu), so limited and so good in the same way...
This System 8 made me return to roland after decades.... |
All fine - I think it sounds really good too - but it doesn't sound like a Juno 106 - according to those presets - and I believe there are enough oscillator, filter, envelope and chorus demos there to make this determination - it sounds - different. Nice - but just different . I've been using the Juno106 since it came out 32 / 33 years ago and has remained in my active setup every since - and I'm genuinely saying - this sounds totally different to the Juno 106. I own two Juno 106's in fact.
What's surprising me is that I also own a JU-06 and it sounds very like a Juno 106 - it really surprised me how close to the original it sounds. In fact there are a few features unique to the Juno 106 that you don't get on any other synth (even the Juno60) and those quirks are there in the JU-06.
Unless they are passing all presets through a second filter, or added effects - then they have changes the ACB model since releasing the JU-06 - but as those demos stand, it sounds genuinely very good, but nothing at all like a Juno 106. I'm very surprised. I'm not trolling here or trying to raise a debate - it genuinely sounds very different. |
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RC-IA Approved Merchant
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 971 Location: FR
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:43 am Post subject: |
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Kevin Nolan wrote: | RC-IA wrote: | Owned it since several weeks, amazing synth, sound is so good. Concerning juno106 emulation, i don't have a juno right here to compare, and would say i don't care so much, but the so called juno106 in system 8 sounds incredibly on its own (meaning that i not looking at it as a juno emu), so limited and so good in the same way...
This System 8 made me return to roland after decades.... |
All fine - I think it sounds really good too - but it doesn't sound like a Juno 106 - according to those presets - and I believe there are enough oscillator, filter, envelope and chorus demos there to make this determination - it sounds - different. Nice - but just different . I've been using the Juno106 since it came out 32 / 33 years ago and has remained in my active setup every since - and I'm genuinely saying - this sounds totally different to the Juno 106. I own two Juno 106's in fact.
What's surprising me is that I also own a JU-06 and it sounds very like a Juno 106 - it really surprised me how close to the original it sounds. In fact there are a few features unique to the Juno 106 that you don't get on any other synth (even the Juno60) and those quirks are there in the JU-06.
Unless they are passing all presets through a second filter, or added effects - then they have changes the ACB model since releasing the JU-06 - but as those demos stand, it sounds genuinely very good, but nothing at all like a Juno 106. I'm very surprised. I'm not trolling here or trying to raise a debate - it genuinely sounds very different. |
Actually the juno106 synth in system8 sounds so good i was almost regretting i did not own a genuine 106.....not sure now since you have it and says they sounds really different ) _________________ https://soundcloud.com/rcmusic35
https://www.youtube.com/user/rcmusic35
https://www.barbandco.com/home-e.html |
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Kevin Nolan Approved Merchant
Joined: 04 Dec 2005 Posts: 2524 Location: Dublin, Ireland
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Don't get me wrong - it sounds like a really good plugout. I really like it. And it sounds similar - but - there were definitely differences - I was surprised to hear a very "plugin / VA" vibe off of it - the Juno 106 definitely doesn't have that. I do know the Juno106 exceedingly well - I've used it on many, many projects since 1985 - so I really know it inside out. The oscillators sound different, and the filter character sounds very different. Regarding the envelopes - the differences may be in their response to turning knobs to moving faders so I can't claim the Envelopes are particularly different - just sound that way from the demos. The chorus he switched on just didn't sound like a juno 106 chorus to me.
I just bought a JU-06 - and have only powered it on and tried it once - but it seems to sound closer to the original (very close in fact) - so the last two System8 Juno106 plugout demos I've watched have surprised me to be honest - I would have expected the JU-06 and the System8 Juno 106 to be the same model and sound the same, but they don't (from these demos).
Perhaps it is 'added stuff' the System 8 can give, and if trimmed down, would sound closer - I'm only going on two sets of demos.
But let me repeat - I'm not looking to knock it as a quality plugout - it sounds exquisite - and I'm not saying that to contradict myself or appease your purchase - some of the pads that guy played were frankly warmer and more useable than the Juno can deliver without external effects.
I'd love to get my hands on it and try it in person - for now there are clear differences to me - but as said I have no problem admitting I like it a lot. |
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RC-IA Approved Merchant
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 971 Location: FR
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spaceman3 Platinum Member
Joined: 25 Jan 2015 Posts: 520
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:36 am Post subject: |
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While taking a break from working on midi stuff.
I watched some more utube videos of the system 8.
I miss judged this synth.
It sounded pretty darned good on some of the other videos, as compared to the first video i viewed. |
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jimknopf Platinum Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011 Posts: 3374
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with Dragon: TAL does a much better job at emulating the classic Junos.
For my ears the whole system 8 does not have great VA modelling. The synths are still well useable - just not well suited as replacements for the originals they try to emulate. Similar for the boutique series.
The JDXA does a much better job at sounding analog, even in mixed analog/digital mode. _________________ Kronos 73 - Moog Voyager RME - Moog LP TE - Behringer Model D - Prophet 6 - Roland Jupiter Xm - Rhodes Stage 73 Mk I - Elektron Analog Rytm MkII - Roland TR-6s - Cubase 12 Pro + Groove Agent 5 |
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skinmechanic Junior Member
Joined: 15 Apr 2015 Posts: 59
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Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 11:08 am Post subject: |
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I've had the System 8 for about two months now. When I first got it, the first few weeks I just wanted to get rid of it. However I've spent a little more time with it and the following I found;
System 8 Synth Engine;
This synth engine sounds very thin and sterile (I think others have said the same). It's great for bright synth sounds but it isn't any different from the System-1 synth engine which again is a low cost VA with four voices, the only thing the System 8 version add's is more voices, and the side chain filter from the V-Synth which unless your doing very harsh distorted sounds isn't worth using beyond that.
Jupiter 8 Plugout;
The patches programmed don't use a lot of the built in effects and so the patches sound more like the JP08 boutique I say that because I've never had a Jupiter 8 so if anyone has discovered that the JP08 is similar to the original then so is this version. However again for me it sounds too familiar maybe because I've used a lot of self made Jupiter 8 patches with the Jupiter 8V plugin and the Jupiter 8 filter within the SNS engine on the Integra-7. Pads and bright sounding patches i've managed to re-create without an issue and I cannot tell any difference between the SNS waveforms and patches on the Integra-7 or the System 8 plugout version. The difference is in the bass sounds, they've done something to the ACB technology that allows for warmer bottom end type sounds.
Juno 106 Plugout;
Interestingly I find this plug-out to be the best sounding out of the three not because of it sounds like the original but just the character of it. My friend has a Juno 106 and we did some A/B testing and I can tell you without effects on it sounds the same in our eyes, so they've done a good job in that respect. Maybe the way to program this plug-out is to build the sounds with No effects at all. The plug out does include the two chorus types from the original synth which you access from the first effect stack which is normally used for the distortion sounds on the Sys 8. One of them does sound like the original the other not so much.
Overall the System 8 is a nice synth, a few drawbacks overall it's slightly expensive overall and it needs to be nearer the price point of the DeepMind 12 which in the UK is £999. This synth should have aftertouch it's begging for it to be there and I normally don;t bother with Aftertouch whatsoever. |
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synthguy Platinum Member
Joined: 05 Jan 2005 Posts: 661
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Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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jimknopf wrote: | The JDXA does a much better job at sounding analog, even in mixed analog/digital mode. |
Well, I would expect an analog synth to sound analog.
Maybe it's the effects, but the demos I listened to of the Ju106 plugout sounded quite a bit juiced up from the original. But I see this as a good thing. Roland's single OSC+SUB synths are okay, but the kinds of sounds you can build with them is rather limited compared to any other two OSC synth.
To my ears, the System-8 engine has been improved over the S-1. Maybe it's all down to the programming, but it seems a little juicier and bouncier. It's definitely a Roland sound, and if only a Juno or Jupiter will suit you, I can see how you might not like it. But as a synth, loaded with the Jupiter, Juno and System 100 plugouts, it sounds dandy to me.
As for the price, comparing anything from any other company to a Behringer product is really unfair. They undercut everyone counting on volume of sales to garner some profit, and they have a whole slew of products to pad their profit margins. Unless you want Behringer to own the music gear market, with a slice going to KORG and Yamaha, you'd better support these other companies like Roland. _________________ PRAY FOR THIS PLANET!! |
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EvilDragon Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005 Posts: 1992 Location: Croatia
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Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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Screw that, DeepMind-12 sounds awesome! |
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Oldretro Junior Member
Joined: 20 Apr 2012 Posts: 91
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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jimknopf wrote: | I agree with Dragon: TAL does a much better job at emulating the classic Junos.
For my ears the whole system 8 does not have great VA modelling. The synths are still well useable - just not well suited as replacements for the originals they try to emulate. Similar for the boutique series.
The JDXA does a much better job at sounding analog, even in mixed analog/digital mode. |
Funny, I found it to be the exact opposite
At least when using the System-8 sound engine. I have tried it side by side with the JD-XA and I think the System-8 has more depth and weight to the sound. Might be because of the third VCO/Sub Osc. Within a few minutes I was in 70's Tangerine Dream and Michael Hoenig (for the insiders: Departure From the Northern Wasteland) territory. A year ago I was thinking about buying the JD-XA but the sound didn't do it for me. True, the JD-XA can do *way* much more and it's great for pads, soundscapes and SFX but that is not the most important aspect of a synth. At least, to me it isn't. BTW, If you solely look at the emulation, you could be right. I never owned the Jupiter-8, nor the Juno 106. Although the Jupiter-8 emulation sounded very nice too. Don't know about the 106, it was not installed on the System-8, in the shop where I tried them. I'm thinking of buying one in the future, but not at the current price.
Edit: I tried a System-8 with the Juno 106 installed and I was very impressed. I immediately recognised it as a Juno 6/60, a synth which I know very well. I don't know if the 106 is similar to the 6/60 electronically, but the Juno character is definitely there.
Last edited by Oldretro on Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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