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keez Junior Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2013 Posts: 97 Location: Wirral, UK
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Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 3:38 am Post subject: Need some help making a basic Moog type sound. |
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I have a Triton Studio fully maxed out (all expansions and moss) and need to replicate a few sounds, but I'll start with just one for now. I'm on a steep learning curve here, so if I can get some help with this one, it will teach me the basics to help me with the others. (i've had the keyboard for just a few days).
What I'm after is the lead-synth sound from Pink Floyd's "Run like hell"......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfUkFLfHSsE#t=2m41s
I'm assuming I'd be best using the moss?
I'm having trouble trying to get the basic sound right and making/applying the correct hpf.
Any help for a noob?
If anyone could give me a start, I'm more than willing to give it a try.
This is what it sounds like to me, just not sure how to input into the Triton.
Sounds like saw wave, no?
Initial HPF and resonance quickly ramps down. The ARE occasion when it needs to ramp back up, but I can do that manually do that with one of the assignable knobs.
The heavy pitch modulation, (starts heavy and then ramps away) can that be programmed in, or will I have to do it manually with the lever? |
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xmlguy Platinum Member
Joined: 26 Nov 2007 Posts: 3605
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Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:06 am Post subject: |
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You can get that sound on just about any synth. What matters most when learning is to use a synth that lets you easily see all the parameters at one time, with little or no effort to edit them to hear the results. Therefore, I recommend a softsynth like the free SYNTH1 VST. It's powerful enough to do most "analog synth" sounds, with all the parameters on one page. Once you know how to make a sound on SYNTH1, then you can easily translate it to any other synth. Then you can use any special features of that synth to improve it and to fine tune it. Although I recommend SYNTH1 because it's free, good enough, and it's popular enough to have some examples on youtube. However, "knobby" synths like the Radias, Novation X-Station/Ultranova, or SH-201 are very good for this too, as are anything with basically a knob, fader, or switch dedicated for all of the most important parameters in the synth engine. Synths that require menu diving are not ones that I would recommend for learning how to synthesize, or to build any sounds for the first time. Menu diving sucks for learning, since you don't know what everything does, so having to search around for it is like trying do a scavenger hunt in an unfamiliar building at night without any lighting besides a candle. A knobby synth is like a well lighted building where everything you need is in one room, layed out for you and ready to go.
Unfortunately, a Triton with a MOSS board requires menu diving unless you buy editor software. So I recommend getting the sound you want on SYNTH1, then after you know exactly what to do, then you can translate it to either the Triton engine or a MOSS VA program. I think the MOSS would be the better of the two, because MOSS is BOSS. I love my Z1. I don't have editor software for my Triton Extreme because I also have the X50 that comes with editor software. I also don't have editor software for the Z1, although I probably should buy one. So far I've been willing to do menu diving on MOSS/Z1 because I've always had a well known patch in mind when I've been editing it,
So, regarding that sound. Yes, it's a supersaw, but a special kind of one. I think it's a 3rd note saw. It has a lot of "english" on it, certainly with envelopes for the AMP and filter. Some portamento, distortion, unison, delay, reverb, chorus/flange are probably in there too. The mod wheel (or aftertouch) is assigned to LFO intensity, and the LFO is doing a rather strong modulation vibrato to the saw. It has a rather slow attack and long release on the envelopes, I think. |
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keez Junior Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2013 Posts: 97 Location: Wirral, UK
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Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for taking the time to type out that very informative response.
Excuse my lack of knowledge, but what's "english"?
Also, how do I increase the intensity of the max pitch modulation when the joystick is pushed all the way up? Can't seem to find the setting anywhere. |
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xmlguy Platinum Member
Joined: 26 Nov 2007 Posts: 3605
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Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, I used a more advanced meaning by referring to "english".
From the Oxford English Dictionary:
3 [mass noun] North American spin or side given to a ball, especially in pool or billiards:
put more English on the ball
In this case, I was using the term to refer to a sound that is not a simple and straightforward wave like a sawtooth or sine, but one that has been highly modulated to make it go in unexpected directions as it is being played dynamically. For example, in tennis you can hit the ball flat on the racket and it will have a rather predictable bounce, but by changing the angle and velocity of the contact of the racket with the ball, you can put topspin, bottom spin, or side spin on the ball to make it do rather strange and unexpected things during flight and when it hits the ground. You can make a ball that would normally fly and bounce straight end up curving in flight and bouncing in an opposite direction than it would normally do. In billiards, you can make a ball curve around others on the table.
Another term that's similar is "motion". That lead synth sound has a lot of motion. The sound is dynamic and moving as it's being played due to various modulations. There are a wide range of modulation sources that can lead to such a dynamic sound, such as keyboard velocity, keyboard position (keytracking), aftertouch pressure, LFO modulation, foot pedal controller, pitch/mod wheel, and midi automation. These modulations are often setup using virtual patches to connect a modulation source to a destination, which has an intensity value attached to the patch. The intensity value can itself be modulated with other patches. The complexity can be tremendous. Reproducing these sounds can be very challenging, since it can be like herding 6 puppies and 6 kittens together to get a photo of them all looking at the camera at the same time. |
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