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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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 Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 3:51 am Post subject: |
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| McHale wrote: | | sparkie wrote: | | Nobody in their right mind would defend Korg like he does when everyone here is having problems..otherwise. |
I'm not having any problems with my KRONOS and many others aren't as well. I can't personally confirm the 1%-ish number, but I will say that not a single person from Korg has ever lied to us about any fact that I'm aware of. |
They may have omitted facts though.
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Current Korg apparatus: MicroStation, MicroKorg, MicroSampler, WaveDrum, Trinity V3, M1REX, Wavestation SR, X5DR, Original Legacy Collection w/ MS-20 controller, iMS-20, DS-10 Plus x2, ELECTRIBE Rhythm Mk ll, iELECTRIBE, Kaossilator, padKONTROL, MicroKONTROL, NanoKey, NanoKontrol, Stage Echo SE-300 |
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sparkie
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 743
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 3:55 am Post subject: |
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| McHale wrote: | | sparkie wrote: | | Nobody in their right mind would defend Korg like he does when everyone here is having problems..otherwise. |
I'm not having any problems with my KRONOS and many others aren't as well. I can't personally confirm the 1%-ish number, but I will say that not a single person from Korg has ever lied to us about any fact that I'm aware of. |
Personally I dont believe it as too many have posted with the problem.. Korg is a business and not your grandmother ..and they go home to their family at 5 PM everynight and forget about keyboards ..just like most people do...Oh yeah I forgot to say.. All except for Martin!  |
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kyoland
Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Posts: 15
Location: New Zealand
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:02 am Post subject: |
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I'm a Kiwi and I've just tried out the SV-1 and the Kronos 61 in my local shop - actually went there with the view of getting the Kronos. The SV-1 had the fault it was obvious on the first run of soft triplets I played. The Kronos was the 61 note version and it was fine.
I have a 76 note oasys and gigged for several years with a triton studio 76 so am adapted to the shallow travel of that keybed but I still need more than the 61 notes of the Kronos - I'm definitely not buying a 73 or 88 note Kronos or the SV-1 after that experience.
Its a shame because a part of me wanted to get the Kronos - we get free soundpacks having bought the Oasys ones originally and I was looking forward to playing a weighted keys version again. The next dilemma is do I sell the fantom X7 and buy a Jupiter 80 or just stick to what works for now.
Damn this is making my head hurt.
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Just play it
Korg forever |
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McHale
Platinum Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 2487
Location: B.F.E.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:05 am Post subject: |
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| rrricky rrrecordo wrote: | | They may have omitted facts though. |
Which facts? Let's have 'em.
If you're calling someone from Korg a liar, say it. But to make random vague comments like that are pretty ignorant since you have zero facts to back anything up.
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Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), SQ-64, DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, 3x nanoPad 2, 3x DS1H, 7x PS1, FC7 (yes Korg, NOT Yamaha). |
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McHale
Platinum Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 2487
Location: B.F.E.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:07 am Post subject: |
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| sparkie wrote: | | ..and they go home to their family at 5 PM everynight and forget about keyboards ..just like most people do...Oh yeah I forgot to say.. All except for Martin! |
WTH?
Most of the Korg reps that post here do it on their own time, after work hours. Are you on drugs or just trying to start fights?
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Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), SQ-64, DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, 3x nanoPad 2, 3x DS1H, 7x PS1, FC7 (yes Korg, NOT Yamaha). |
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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:15 am Post subject: |
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OK, RH3 is a huge problem for Korg. Fact. Admission? Nope.
Less than 1 percent affliction rate - another omission of facts. Well ok, <1%, but based on what criteria? This forum? Sure, ok
Mchale's Navy with Cap'n Hines at the helm... Go team Korgfan!!!
gregc outta weigh anchor any time now
_________________
Current Korg apparatus: MicroStation, MicroKorg, MicroSampler, WaveDrum, Trinity V3, M1REX, Wavestation SR, X5DR, Original Legacy Collection w/ MS-20 controller, iMS-20, DS-10 Plus x2, ELECTRIBE Rhythm Mk ll, iELECTRIBE, Kaossilator, padKONTROL, MicroKONTROL, NanoKey, NanoKontrol, Stage Echo SE-300 |
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kyoland
Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Posts: 15
Location: New Zealand
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:16 am Post subject: |
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Oh and I meant to say - these problems are'nt confined to one manufacturer, or just modern keys - the older ones had problems too. I had cold solder issues on the output jacks of several M1's one within a week of it coming home from the dealer in Auckland, my Fantom X7 had to have a component changed a couple of months after I bought it - some motherboard issue.
The oasys even had a major problem with a touchscreen showing a disconnect icon that took months to fix, the wavestation AD had a faulty backlight that needed replacement a month after I got it.
The yamaha motif had two keys that needed replacing, the ensoniq KS 32 had an entire keybed that needed replacement as the springs were inadequate making the black notes faster and louder to play than the white.
Its not some new thing that production keyboards have quality issues. But it is a PITA to deal with and one that we would all try to avoid.
Anyway have a great Christmas - and Yeah I'd still buy a Korg but maybe the next model - I think this Oasys / Kronos software is a great platform to build on.
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Just play it
Korg forever |
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sparkie
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 743
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:18 am Post subject: |
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| McHale wrote: | | sparkie wrote: | | ..and they go home to their family at 5 PM everynight and forget about keyboards ..just like most people do...Oh yeah I forgot to say.. All except for Martin! |
WTH?
Most of the Korg reps that post here do it on their own time, after work hours. Are you on drugs or just trying to start fights? |
I agree they do.. however I think they need to follow up to others here. I was a Korg fanboy, happy with M3 ..Oasys before that.. until I bought the Kronos. I may buy a Kronos again down the road but only if the problems are corrected. I learned my lesson about buying one for the first ones ...
signed Captain Wallace B. Binghamton |
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Bruce Lychee
Platinum Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 856
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:24 am Post subject: |
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In fairness to Korg, all Rich said at the time of his announcement was that at that time, the reported rate was less than 1%. I think that was probably true at the time. I don't think it reflects the actual failure rate, but at that time most cases probably hadn't even been officially reported and other afflicted units may simply not have been sold yet.
That being said, I think giving a percentage at that time wasn't informative at all and only served to give the impression that the problem is very limited. I'd be interested to see if they ever follow up with a final estimated failure rate.
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Shigeru Kawai SK5
Roland Jupiter 80
Vintage Vibe 64 |
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keyplayer14
Full Member
Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 160
Location: Exeter
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| MartinHines wrote: |
What if Korg is having trouble detemining why certain units have the problem and others don't? If this problem was SO EASY to solve why didn't M3-88s and SV-1s all have the same problem? Why is the problem only impacting some Kronos . |
Unfortunately there is YouTube footage of an SV-1 exhibiting exactly the same problem ( it's too late for me to start looking now, but I'll post a link tomorrow), so it would seem that this RH3 problem predates the Kronos - which makes the whole thing pretty much inexcusable IMHO .
As I've posted before I certainly don't have the issue so badly as to make my board unplayable, and I love the possibilies the Kronos gives me, but that doesn't mean it's acceptable - and I suspect that the quoted 1% figure could be the tip of a worryingly large iceberg.
I very much hope I'm wrong about that.
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Korg Kronos 88, Trinity Plus, Wavestation SR, X5D, M1
Roland RD 700, V-Synth GT, Jupiter 80, JV 1080
Akai MPD32, Cubase 5, NI Komplete, Spectrasonics Omnisphere, Stylus RMX |
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McHale
Platinum Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 2487
Location: B.F.E.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:42 am Post subject: |
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| keyplayer14 wrote: | | ...so it would seem that this RH3 problem predates the Kronos - which makes the whole thing pretty much inexcusable IMHO . |
You do realize that real pianos, even the most expensive, can also double strike, right? Have any of you commented on Steinway's forums yet?
_________________
Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), SQ-64, DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, 3x nanoPad 2, 3x DS1H, 7x PS1, FC7 (yes Korg, NOT Yamaha). |
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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:51 am Post subject: |
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yeah, if it's an expensive vertical piano
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Current Korg apparatus: MicroStation, MicroKorg, MicroSampler, WaveDrum, Trinity V3, M1REX, Wavestation SR, X5DR, Original Legacy Collection w/ MS-20 controller, iMS-20, DS-10 Plus x2, ELECTRIBE Rhythm Mk ll, iELECTRIBE, Kaossilator, padKONTROL, MicroKONTROL, NanoKey, NanoKontrol, Stage Echo SE-300 |
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keyplayer14
Full Member
Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 160
Location: Exeter
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:54 am Post subject: |
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| McHale wrote: | | keyplayer14 wrote: | | ...so it would seem that this RH3 problem predates the Kronos - which makes the whole thing pretty much inexcusable IMHO . |
You do realize that real pianos, even the most expensive, can also double strike, right? Have any of you commented on Steinway's forums yet? |
Of course, but usually as a consequence of poorly regulated or worn out actions. What percentage of Steinways do you suppose exhibit the behaviour from brand new?
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Korg Kronos 88, Trinity Plus, Wavestation SR, X5D, M1
Roland RD 700, V-Synth GT, Jupiter 80, JV 1080
Akai MPD32, Cubase 5, NI Komplete, Spectrasonics Omnisphere, Stylus RMX |
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Ojustaboo
Platinum Member
Joined: 08 Jul 2011
Posts: 1154
Location: UK
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:56 am Post subject: |
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| MartinHines wrote: |
Put another way, this thread SHOULD BE about people who have the double-note problem with their specific keyboard, not a place for "drive-by" shooters to attack Korg who don't actually have the problem. |
I disagree.
Apart from the fact that most if not all of the posters criticising those that complain about korg in this thread, actually aren't experiencing the cut off problem themselves (so what are they doing in this thread using your logic),
I was saving hard for a kronos, this thread, seeing how badly Korg has reacted to the problem, how theres still no answer from Korg, is the sole reason I have put on hold semi permanently buying one.
Faults occur, problems happen. How companies big or small react and communicate with those having the problems is in my opinion what makes a good or bad company.
Even though I've put buying one on hold, I still can't believe how badly korg are dealing with this and it depends entirely on how they end up sorting it for example those that haven't been able to play for three months and counting, will korg compensate them in some way whether it's an extended warranty or whatever, or will korg seem not to care, depending on the final outcome depends on whether I will consider or recommend to others buying a korg product in the forseeable future.
If there was a similar problem with say a Roland board, and I was thinking of buying that particular board, I would be pleased if someone like Sparkie who experienced them first hand came onto this Korg forum and warned potential buyers of the problems many people are having.
At the end of the day, if korg handled this properly, Sparkie would still own his board and wouldn't be on complaining about them on another forum.
I like it that people can voice when they've had good or bad service from a company on various internet forums, it's a very good indication of whether the company concerned is one I want to deal with. And while obviously most people are going to be voicing problems they have had, how they say the company dealt with the problem is a good indicator of what sort of company it really is.
Just because a company has been good for say the past 30 years, doesn't mean it's still good now and that applies to all companies. One of the biggest complaint I both have and see others having with various companies is lack of keeping the customer informed of how their faults being dealt with.
I brought my first Korg synth 30 years ago, then a Korg Trident mk 2 which I loved, I know how good korg have been in the past but then again I never had a problem in the past. I now have a M3 73 with exp Radias and it's a superb instrument (although personally I think it's the ugliest keyboard I've ever owned). But at the end of the day I am a customer and have zero brand loyalty. If korg, roland or whoever brings out a keyboard I like, then I will buy it. If I have a problem thats not something silly I will mention it in various forums, and will give praise or critisism as to the way the company handled my problem.
If I had brought a kronos three months ago and had the note cut off problems and also received the lack of korg support shown on here, I would be fuming. When a customer is angry they tend to point out every little tiny fault they can see as their minds go into negative mode, thats natural and korg has only themselves to blame for the many negative comments going around the internet.
A couple of weeks ago I was on a popular piano playing forum and found a thread warning people about thinking of buying the kronos, linking to youtube vids showing the problem. The thread was titled "korg kronos keys of death" and the first post said
" User videos on YouTube clearly demonstrate the severity of the problem for those who are experiencing it. The problem is further aggravated by the fact that it seems to develop over time in some cases. I only noticed notes double triggering a few weeks ago, 5 months into ownership.
Korg has been completely quiet on the issue and users are left with the option of returning their units if within the return period, or sending the units to local repair centers for long term parking. If you call Korg customer service, they will not even acknowledge awareness of the issue"
That was posted on 21st November two months after being brought up on this site, yet they couldn't even get korg to admit there was a problem. It's people being treated like that thats causing this problem to be a nightmare for korg and has lost korg many sales a fair few people in this thread alone have said they are going a different route due to this mess.
And when you have people simply be rude to those trying to have a reasoned debate, such as yourself about sparkie or McHale responding to my post in a very mature way with a fail pic, it sort of makes you look like you simply won't hear a bad word said about your beloved Korg and makes the prospect of any reasoned debate from you seem very very unlikely.
Joe |
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McHale
Platinum Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 2487
Location: B.F.E.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:59 am Post subject: |
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| keyplayer14 wrote: | | Of course, but usually as a consequence of poorly regulated or worn out actions. What percentage of Steinways do you suppose exhibit the behaviour from brand new? |
It's also (and more usually) caused by playing style and technique. It happens on BRAND new pianos as well as old ones.
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Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), SQ-64, DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, 3x nanoPad 2, 3x DS1H, 7x PS1, FC7 (yes Korg, NOT Yamaha). |
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