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Kronos 88 and RH3 keyboard faulty
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PianoManChuck
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Joined: 09 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kim wrote:
But didn't you have a wirking Kronos at the beginning? If so, this is troublesome if the problem would manifest as time goes by. It means no one is safe from this problem.

Yes and no... it worked fine in the beginning, then a few weeks later it started to get the note cutoff problem. By fluke, once I calibrated the DS1H half pedal, the problem seemed to have disappeared... turns out that was just mere coincidence. A couple of months after that, the problem came back, a couple of notes at first, then more, and more.

Kim wrote:

The silence of Korg is deafening. Look at Apple, Microsoft or Nokia: when they screw up, they tell about it ASAP and have a solution ready within days. Korg really should take notice, because this is harming customer relatiinship in a serious way. How things are now, I doubt I ever will be an early adopter for Korg ever again. Please prove me wrong, Korg!

Agreed 100%. I've been using Korg equipment (among others) since 1999. I've lost a lot of trust in Korg over this. To have an instrument costing a few thousand dollars sitting there unusable, is completely unacceptable. From now on, any future Korg purchases will have to wait until that product has been out on the market for at least a year. A problem like this from Nord, Yamaha, Roland, Kurzweil, or even Privia (Casio's pro line) is non-existent.
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Chriskk
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The solution should be (1) redesign the RH3 keybed, and (2) replace all faulty RH3 keybeds for free. This would be a financial disaster for a small company like KORG.

I guess they know the cause of the problem. They are just thinking about how to handle it. My guess is they will release a new software update that will ignore low velocity notes.
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MartinHines
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kim wrote:
The silence of Korg is deafening. Look at Apple, Microsoft or Nokia: when they screw up, they tell about it ASAP and have a solution ready within days. Korg really should take notice, because this is harming customer relatiinship in a serious way.


You do realize a company like Microsoft or Apple are at least 1,000 times larger than Korg, yes?

Korg needs time to (1) determine the actual problem and (2) determine a fix. The majority of Kronos owners do not have this problem, and the Kronos is not the first Korg keyboard to have the RH3 keybed (SV-1, M3-88, Korg Digital Piano).

I am confident Korg is working hard on the problem, and will eventually come up with a solution. Not every problem has a "quick fix".
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seapea
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rmvieira wrote:
Just to summarize and be clear. By fixing the slightly bent metal by the keybed my "RH3 problems" went away. The keybed was not replaced. The metal bowing may or may not be visible to others with the same problem as the spacing is quite small.

Is this bent metal strip, the black front of the Kronos that, for sake of description, your stomach would hit if you leaned into keyboard when playing. And please lets not start discussions about whether size of one's stomach relates to whether you have a keyboard problem or not. Very Happy Just trying to locate bent strip. Because the front middle of my Kronos is bent in a good 6 mm from the ends, when I put a long steel ruler to check straighness along front.
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rmvieira
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is it exactly. It is the case from the front starting just below the tips of the keys.
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PianoManChuck
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rmvieira wrote:
That is it exactly. It is the case from the front starting just below the tips of the keys.

... so, how exactly do/did you fix this??
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billysynth1
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

haha, what are you guys talking about...bent metal and your going to straighten it? Korg bent it, Korg can fix it.

Oh my god, this whole Kronos is a debacle to say the least. I'm going to Burn it!! Put it in a coffin and send it back to Japan Land.

Billy
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Ten2One
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:19 pm    Post subject: note cutoff Reply with quote

I looked down at the edge of the keys and there is a difference in the width of the gap between the end of the keys and the case. It narrows below middle C and is wider as it moves up to the higher registers. How could this impact notes cutting off?

If it somehow interferes with the movement of the key-bed that might be why some don't have it and later on it appears. Leaning against it, or lightly bumping it could push the frame in ever-so-lightly and cause the problem. Or, is this just us trying to come up with something that will give us hope because Korg hasn't offered any as of yet?

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sparkie
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MartinHines wrote:
Kim wrote:
The silence of Korg is deafening. Look at Apple, Microsoft or Nokia: when they screw up, they tell about it ASAP and have a solution ready within days. Korg really should take notice, because this is harming customer relatiinship in a serious way.


You do realize a company like Microsoft or Apple are at least 1,000 times larger than Korg, yes?

Korg needs time to (1) determine the actual problem and (2) determine a fix. The majority of Kronos owners do not have this problem, and the Kronos is not the first Korg keyboard to have the RH3 keybed (SV-1, M3-88, Korg Digital Piano).

I am confident Korg is working hard on the problem, and will eventually come up with a solution. Not every problem has a "quick fix".


Yep working hard, Considering they have been aware of the problem for over a month shouldn't they already have some answers and solutions. A report from Korg was to be mid December for an update and they are late with that?

With the data knob & note cutoff problems, 2K ram being left out for who knows why, editor late & still unfinished is not what I would call good customer service. Whoever was responsible for beta testing before being released should have recognized these problems beforehand and pre-planned for additional sound & program updates that would use more ram space. Period... Or maybe it was a matter of some manager just wanting to get sales quickly and "just get it out there" and we will fix it later.

I dont know where you get your facts but I suspect than definitely more than 1% have the note cutoff problem. Unlike private users here, since many Kronos are sold to businesses or churches I wonder how many sell with problems unnoticed unless it is pointed out to them, or they find it later on.
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KorgKeymaster
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I meant to post in one of my earlier replies that a sales rep at guitar center instisted that the cutoff/double strike problem is definitely fixed in the 1.5 update.

I didn't bother to inform him that its not. ...he was the Korg specialist at that guitar center.

Either he was intentionally lying or just seriously misinformed.


Last edited by KorgKeymaster on Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:10 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ten2One
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I slipped the cardboard back in the front of the kronos and slid it back and forth and still notes cutting off right and left. When you pay near 4g's for something you shouldn't have to do anything but play it!


Ten2One
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MartinHines
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sparkie wrote:

Yep working hard, Considering they have been aware of the problem for over a month shouldn't they already have some answers and solutions. A report from Korg was to be mid December for an update and they are late with that?

What if Korg is having trouble detemining why certain units have the problem and others don't? If this problem was SO EASY to solve why didn't M3-88s and SV-1s all have the same problem? Why is the problem only impacting some Kronos units?

The "mid-December" comment was an ESTIMATE. Do you understand the meaning of the word "estimate"? The accuracy of that estimate would depend on where there were in the process.

If I were Korg I would have stated something like "we hope to provide an update on this situation some time in December".


sparkie wrote:

With the data knob & note cutoff problems, 2K ram being left out for who knows why, editor late & still unfinished is not what I would call good customer service.

-- Data Knob problem -- fixed
-- Note cutoff problem -- under investigation
-- 2K RAM left out -- cost control
-- Editor late -- unfortunate

Yes the Kronos appears to have had more problems than previous Korg keyboards. However, Korg is working through them. I would much rather have the Kronos to play now than have waited until the editor was finished.

sparkie wrote:

Whoever was responsible for beta testing before being released should have recognized these problems beforehand and pre-planned for additional sound & program updates that would use more ram space.

-- You obviously don't understand the function of beta testing if you believe all problems are discovered in beta testing; they are not.
-- "pre-planned"? So you are saying all functionality should be delivered at the outset? This is completely contrary to all software development.

sparkie wrote:

I dont know where you get your facts but I suspect than definitely more than 1% have the note cutoff problem.

The 1% figure came from Korg. The percentage may be higher but I said "the majority of Kronos units don't have this problem" which is correct.

Finally Sparkie, why are you even commenting on this since? You sold your Kronos, then trashed Korg and the Kronos over at the Roland Clan forums, so you really shouldn't be concerned with the Kronos at all.

You need to stop trolling.
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Korg USA Product support -- https://www.korgusa.com/contactus (For fastest service I would suggest calling them on the phone)

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rmvieira
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The bent metal in front was fixed by an authorized Korg repair center. I don't know how they straightened it but that fixed my notes cutoff, etc. I'm guessing the keybed is attached to the front chassis and that deviations in the metal cause spacing issues sufficient to create these problems. The cardboard will probably not work as a correction.
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rmvieira
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should mention that the technician said the bent metal was definitely the cause of the keys sticking. Other people may not have keys physically sticking but that doesn't mean the keybed isn't affected in other ways. As I mentioned before, only the sticking keys had the note cutoff in my case.
IMHO the 2 are related.
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xtatty
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MartinHines wrote:
What if Korg is having trouble detemining why certain units have the problem and others don't?
If this problem was SO EASY to solve why didn't M3-88s and SV-1s all have the same problem?
Why is the problem only impacting some Kronos units?

You are wrong on that one MartinHines.

There is a video on youtube that shows a SV-1 with the same problem.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhmbGfaHy7U&feature=related

Also at my video on youtube, someone made a comment saying that he has the exact same problem with his M3-88. Read the comments...
http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=JRaOfxDrIgg

We don't know if there are more units with the same problem,
but we sure have one representative from each model.
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