 |
Korg Forums
A forum for Korg product users and musicians around the world.
Moderated Independently.
Owned by Irish Acts Recording Studio & hosted by KORG USA
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Charlie
Platinum Member
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 997
Location: Austria
|
 Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:54 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
You wont hear that from Korg before it has actually happened. And for me this policy is one of the root-causes for all these long and exhausting discussions, the frustration, misunderstandings and the anger of some Oasys users ... 
_________________
www.charliemclight.com/en/home.html
www.facebook.com/charliemclight |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
SoulBe
Senior Member
Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Posts: 499
Location: Germany
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| MartinHines wrote: | is a financial out-of-pocket cost with practically zero chance of earning any money from it.
............
I suspect Toyota did not even consider spending additional money to try to retrofit software advancements from the new model into my old model.
............
I believe Korg had the best intentions, but some of you think otherwise. |
Hi Martin,
first point: I understand but ... sometimes a company in my opinion has to do pro bono work or charge for updates when it comes to reliability and credibility. Maybe this would be a financial loss at the moment but a gain of confidence and potential customers in the future when the O´s hardware is definetivly too slow/old
second point: what about lets say ms windows providing service packs for the operating system? I could compare the O with a version which is still provided?
third point: I also think they had, but again sometimes I think a branch/company has also to think about how they can make their customers to trust into the company... and that´s my point: If !!!! really Kronos OS/functions is a kind of OASYS 2.0 OS that could be taken over.
regards
SoulBe |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Akos Janca
Platinum Member
Joined: 16 Mar 2005
Posts: 1158
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| SoulBe wrote: | One last word about treatment of customers:
I bought my trusty Yamaha P 80 piano in 2000. After more and more keys got stuck I asked Yamaha about if this keybed had failures and ..... they changed the whole keybed for free in 2010 ... 8 years after warrenty went out !!!!!!!!!
Regards
SoulBe |
Just to share something uplifting:
Almost exactly the same happened to me in 2007!
I got a Yamaha S08, it was 3 years old (a simpler instrument but great action for the price). The inner ends of the keys started to break and got unusable. I wrote a mail to yamahasynth.com customer support (I sent photos and asked for new keys to replace myself). They directed me to Yamaha Music Central Europe in Germany. After confirming the serial number they told it was a manufacturing defect so they treated it as a "warranty-repair" even if the instrument was older than the official 2-year warranty. I didn't have the original receipt from the previous owner but they didn't care (the serial was enough). So they sent me to the Hungarian service center and they replaced the whole keyboard assembly for free. I brough the instrument there and it took 1 hour.
That's what I call First Class Customer Support! I won't forget Yamaha. Professional instruments and trusty service, perfect everywhere: in Japan, in Germany and in Hungary. Thank you again. 
_________________
AkosJanca.com | Facebook | YouTube | SoundCloud | FuturePlant || OASYS-demos | nanoROCK demo | Korg Band in the Garage demo | Kronos Demo 1 | Kronos Demo 2 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vEddY
Platinum Member
Joined: 20 Jul 2002
Posts: 1263
Location: Zagreb
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| MartinHines wrote: |
Again these words you use imply Korg had some type of malicious intent. I disagree.
Would you really have been happier if Korg never created a product like the Kronos, never reused OASYS technology, putting it into a less expensive package to enable many more people to be able to use it?
I am glad Korg is releasing a product like the Kronos, as opposed to releasing something like the M3 but with an expanded Sound ROM (like Roland and Yamaha have done). I thought the OASYS was a fantastic product, and I am glad Korg has created a product that more people can afford.
|
There you go again. I clearly stated that I like KRONOS as a product and that I hope they'll be very successful with it. Which part of that didn't you get so far? You just choose to ignore facts. Fact - they announced that they're discontinuing it, then they re-developed it, and sold it for a much lower price with a different name.
It's not KRONOS that's the problem. I CLEARLY said that the problem is business affairs and relations with buyers. And you're becoming a bit passive-agressive on me without any real reason. I'm trying to discuss facts here. You're discussing what you "think" I said. I'm not putting anything between the lines so stop trying to look for "hidden meaning" in my words. I never said they're malicious. What I did, however say, is that they didn't deliver upon their promises, then discontinnued OASYS, then re-packaged it with all the same software and updates and are now selling it at much lower price. I can't know what they are or aren't thinking, so therefor I'm not saying they're malicious. But I sure as hell can point out what I think about business practices like this.
| MartinHines wrote: |
Fine. I was wrong. Korg released a very minor bug fix for one of their most popular and best selling keyboards five years after its release.
A minor bug fix is not the same as the type of upgrades we are talking about (and the type you expected with the OASYS). I suspect if Korg finds out something they think is significantly wrong with the OASYS it may receive a future bug fix also.
|
I mentioned this to discuss a principle. I discinctly remember people reporting quite a few problems that they have software-wise that weren't repaired. For example, I'm yet to hear whatever happened to one stupid thing that OASYS does more often then not - when it's turned on and I plug in a USB flash drive, it doesn't recognize it. However, it always recognizes it when I turn it off, insert a USB flash drive and then turn it on. I would sincerely appericiate a bugfix for that as it costs me a shitload of time everytime I need to get something from USB flash drive.
| MartinHines wrote: |
I guess you and I will simply have to disagree.
|
That's no problem, man 
| MartinHines wrote: |
You imply there was malicious intent on the part of Korg. I believe they made promises they intended to keep, but could not. In my mind, that is a big distinction. You believe development on the OASYS and Kronos are one in the same. I believe the Kronos is a different product with its own individual business case and funding, even if the project used the OASYS software as its starting point. |
Which promises are we talking about? Initial promises which they couldn't deliver? How is that OASYS buyer's mistake and did they offer anything of any substantional value to cover that? Maybe it would've been fine if they issued an apology for that, which they never did. Or are we talking about "final promises" about "discontinuing OASYS as the economic climate doesn't leave any room for development", which they did anyway, and introduced a new product based on OASYS and those developments? Which is just as partly-not-OK as a principle?
Let me be a parrot one more time. I like KRONOS. This is about behavior towards OASYS buyers, not KRONOS. I'm talking about common honest approach to a subject, Martin. Something honorable to do. Nothing else. I'm not discussing feelings that might or might not be there (malicious), but doing rational reasoning about facts. And the sumtotal of those facts is a straight line anyone can follow without a problem.
And by that, I feel that I've exhausted all the patience I have for repeating same things over and over again. Let's do something productive I've got a show to do in some 20 minutes
_________________
Check out http://it-review.net. Reviews and news - hardware, software and musical instruments.
Personally? LPI. RHCE, RHCI, RHCX, RHCVA. MCITP 2008 certification done. MCITP Virtualization Administrator done. MCITP Exchange 2010 done. MCITP MS SQL 2008 done. MCT done. MCSE Server Infrastructure 2012, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSE:Messaging and MCSE: Desktop Infrastructure done. VCP5-DV done. VCI done. MCITP: Sharepoint 2010 Administrator done. VCP5-Cloud done. VCP5-DT done. VCAP5-DCA done. VCP6-DCV done.
Last edited by vEddY on Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vEddY
Platinum Member
Joined: 20 Jul 2002
Posts: 1263
Location: Zagreb
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| rtucker55 wrote: | This thread is now 5 pages and most of it pertains to why Korg did what they did instead of the ops Topic. We all have our perceived thoughts why but I don't think the majority of us Truly Know or ever will.
To any of the Korg guys that have read this thread. Is there any chance that Korg will now unlock all expansions for the Oasys now that it's been discontinued?
|
Sorry for that, I'll stop talking about that and go back to topic at hand.
Even though there were thowsands of buyers who paid for those updates, I do hope they offer that kind of support to all of the remaining users. It would be a step in the right direction, even if that doesn't cover all of the OASYS owners. Hope you guys get those upgrades for free, I really do.
_________________
Check out http://it-review.net. Reviews and news - hardware, software and musical instruments.
Personally? LPI. RHCE, RHCI, RHCX, RHCVA. MCITP 2008 certification done. MCITP Virtualization Administrator done. MCITP Exchange 2010 done. MCITP MS SQL 2008 done. MCT done. MCSE Server Infrastructure 2012, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSE:Messaging and MCSE: Desktop Infrastructure done. VCP5-DV done. VCI done. MCITP: Sharepoint 2010 Administrator done. VCP5-Cloud done. VCP5-DT done. VCAP5-DCA done. VCP6-DCV done. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cello
Platinum Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 2152
Location: Glasgow, UK
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Trying to keep this on topic...
Yes would be good if Korg unlocked all the expansions, however there are a lot of people have those unlocked already so Korg would only address a percentage of O users. And of course they are all being bundled in the Kronos so there's no real value to that action.
If Korg wanted to address all O users, then they should port over all of the Kronos that can be ported. I accept it can't all be. But O users know, having seen screenshots for Kronos, that it is OASYS inside - like Intel. Remember the adverts? 'It's intel inside'. Same with the K - 'it's OASYS inside'! 
As I posted elsewhere, if the results of my poll post regarding update/upgrade (in OASYS area) was translated in revenue across all O users (assuming 3,000 units), Korg could make over $500,000 by releasing a Kronos update that costs UP TO $500.
Nowthat would be the better gesture. It won't affect Kronos sales as it has the extras that the O doesn't, so Korg can rest easy regarding sales - and O users would be satisfied that their investment has not been flushed down the toilet...
_________________
Plugged in: Fantom 8, Jupiter-X, Jupiter 80, System-8, JD-XA, V-Synth GTv2, FA-06, SE-02, JU-06A, TR-09, VT-4, Go:Livecast, Rubix44, Shure SM7b, Push2, Ableton 11 Suite, Sibelius, KRK Rokit 5, |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
SoulBe
Senior Member
Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Posts: 499
Location: Germany
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Akos Janca wrote: |
That's what I call First Class Customer Support! I won't forget Yamaha. Professional instruments and trusty service, perfect everywhere: in Japan, in Germany and in Hungary. Thank you again. |
... so Martin, you see? This is what I was trying to express(sorry for my bad english): a company does some pro bono (ok a keybed is not a hundred thousands of dollars, but it is about the basic customer treatment) and customers will honorate that ..... I´ll keep my eyes open for products of a company with this support
Regards
SoulBe |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Zeroesque
Senior Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Posts: 451
Location: SoCal
|
| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Naviára wrote: | | MartinHines wrote: | | Naviára wrote: | But with Oasys and Kronos we have a complete new situation (sorry if I repeat myself) - for the first time we have compatible and equal hardware performance and a simple software update could change a Oasys to a Kronos - Korg only has to work on an installer for the Oasys. This job usually could be done in a few days, if it isn't just hours. Like I said before.. they don't have to do it for free..
|
This is simply not true. Korg would not be able to run the Kronos software on an OASYS with a "simple software update". If it were that simple, Korg would have done it. |
Hi Martin,
yes it's just that simple - they don't build a completly new software.. they took the Oasys OS 1.3.3a and added a few things - all the inforation about the O, the button layout, the audio engine is still there.. they didn't even change the "soundcard" - what they have to do is to make a bigger script... for the lower screen resolution...
A. |
Naviára, perhaps you should send your resume to Korg so that you can do this for them, you know, in like an hour or two. I promise they will hire you and pay you an amazing sum of money if you are able to do this. Google, IBM and MS will be beating down your door as well.
The simple fact is that the new pianos don't fit into the RAM of OASYS. The OASYS does not stream samples. It doesn't have an SSD hard drive. The hardware is completely different. Name one part of one that will fit the other. Tell us how they implemented VMT and Smooth Sound Transition. Just flip a switch in the software, yeah? You gotta be kidding me.
_________________
Kronos 61, Kronos2-88, Hammond B3, Baldwin SD-10 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hedegaard
Senior Member
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 498
Location: Denmark
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Oh lawd, a noobie..... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Naviára
Junior Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2010
Posts: 52
Location: germany
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | Naviára, perhaps you should send your resume to Korg so that you can do this for them, you know, in like an hour or two. I promise they will hire you and pay you an amazing sum of money if you are able to do this. Google, IBM and MS will be beating down your door as well. |
If you understand how both machines work, then you will come to the same conclusion. I'm not a programmer - but I know how PC-systems work. Kronos and Oasys are pure software synthesizers inside a hardware case, driven by classic PC components.. The processing power is equal (it seems like the CPU in the Oasys is still a bit faster) - The OS language is the same, Korg just updated the original Oasys OS and named it different (instead of Oasys OS 2.0.0 they called the thing Kronos)
| Quote: | | The simple fact is that the new pianos don't fit into the RAM of OASYS. |
Hmmm -> Oasys 2GB - Kronos 2GB - what am I missing here?
| Quote: | | The OASYS does not stream samples. |
Not now, but this isn't a hardware feature, it is a software solution
| Quote: | | It doesn't have an SSD hard drive. |
I'm sure you don't need one for diskstreaming - but you can equip the O with wonderful affordable 32GB SSD IDE drives - a IDE SSD doubles the reading speed by x2 (40-52 MB/s HDD / 70-80 MB/s SSD)
| Quote: | | The hardware is completely different. |
That isn't true !! Just the PC components and the screen - but the whole inside hardware-architecture for running all the engines is the same.
| Quote: | | Name one part of one that will fit the other. |
Okay, same audiohardware, same x86 system layout, same button layout, even the basic OS is the same - or- > that's just a Oasys with a different CPU and screen.
| Quote: | | Tell us how they implemented VMT and Smooth Sound Transition. Just flip a switch in the software, yeah? You gotta be kidding me. |
Yes it's that easy you don't have to flip a switch - as soon as the Kronos OS is installed on the O harddrive (SSD or HDD), all the features will work the same way like on Kronos.
Simply spoken - you have no Oasys anymore - you have a Kronos! It's the same Kronos you can buy at stores soon... there is no difference!
All what the programmers have to do is some customization - making the font a little bit bigger for the lower resolution screen of the O - and activating the missing audio-inputs/outputs the O has. Korg has to build a installer for the O users, or could sell a SSD with customized Kronos OS installed.
Only the USB to PC connection will not work (because of the missing port on the O), the VSTi will (with a simple Midi connection) - still the USB audio stream is missing, but you can also use the SP/DIF output for that...
greetings,
A.
_________________
Korg gear: Triton Extreme 61 MOSS / OASYS 88 #1722
http://soundcloud.com/anthony-walters
http://www.naviara.de |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TonyGen
Full Member
Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 193
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
| cello wrote: |
If Korg wanted to address all O users, then they should port over all of the Kronos that can be ported. I accept it can't all be. But O users know, having seen screenshots for Kronos, that it is OASYS inside - like Intel. Remember the adverts? 'It's intel inside'. Same with the K - 'it's OASYS inside'! |
Hi cello. Well you know my feelings on Korg's treatment of high-end customers since you joined this forum.
I suggest they got one letter wrong in the Kronos launch.....what they meant to say was......
.............The Name Has Been Changed........... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Naviára
Junior Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2010
Posts: 52
Location: germany
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Charlie
Platinum Member
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 997
Location: Austria
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cello
Platinum Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 2152
Location: Glasgow, UK
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| TonyGen wrote: | | .............The Name Has Been Changed........... |
LMAO
Pure genius TG - absolute classic and the most truthful statement ever made, summing everything up perfectly!!!!
_________________
Plugged in: Fantom 8, Jupiter-X, Jupiter 80, System-8, JD-XA, V-Synth GTv2, FA-06, SE-02, JU-06A, TR-09, VT-4, Go:Livecast, Rubix44, Shure SM7b, Push2, Ableton 11 Suite, Sibelius, KRK Rokit 5,
Last edited by cello on Tue Jan 25, 2011 5:31 pm; edited 5 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hedegaard
Senior Member
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 498
Location: Denmark
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yes I agree, a name change..... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
