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JonSolo
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 Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 2:17 am Post subject: Is it time for a MIDI update??? |
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The General MIDI (and GM2) spec is getting pretty dated...and worse yet MIDI itself is closing on 30 years fast. Do any of you feel like the specs need to be broadened or updated?
Right now there is even a limit on the length of the cable for MIDI. But are we stuck for good? For example, we have tons of new developments and inventions which range from Bluetooth to Broadband, and other forms of wireless communications all of which could be incorporated into the spec. Imagine no more MIDI cables!
What about channels? 16 channels is starting to feel like Bill Gates 512K limitation comment. While we can accomplish more options with filtering and finagling there is still that limitation. Imagine 256 or more channels!
Anyone else?
Jon Solo
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RVNOak
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 5:40 am Post subject: |
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I'm always for more channels and wireless. I have actually been toying with the idea of using wireless hub and two computers to just see if I can transmit wirelessy (of course the cost and usefullness would be far out but I enjoy the idea of the challenge).
Truthfullly, I wish they would come out with a wireless for keyboards that could handle all the analog signals (L/R, Individual outs 1-4) instead of having to buy 6 seperate wireless systems. Imagine no more patch cords running from the synths and around other stuff!!
One thing I can say in MIDI defense - it's simple. This is why it has been an industry standard for thirty years. Using a MIDI patchbay helps with some of the channel problems but I can surely see where more channels would be better. WoW, you got me dreaming about this. I'll stop now as I can see myself writing a story on the possibilities 
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krazy78
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Do any of you feel like the specs need to be broadened or updated? |
This has been at the back of my mind for a while now!!!
I definately agree, while midi is the best invention for music in general, the system is getting pretty outdated, especially GM2. A basic subtractive synth should be incorporated into it somehow. 128 channels should be the standard. Using midi cables sucks as well...
The next generation of keyboards should transmit hi-speed wireless midi, (or a little dongle which plugs into the midi port - retrofit for older keyboards  ) wireless reciever/hub , to send signals to other gear, sort of like MIDI networking 
Its only a matter of time......... |
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RVNOak
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| krazy78 wrote: | The next generation of keyboards should transmit hi-speed wireless midi, (or a little dongle which plugs into the midi port - retrofit for older keyboards ) wireless reciever/hub , to send signals to other gear, sort of like MIDI networking
Its only a matter of time......... |
I couldn't agree more. I think if done right and with the use of a laptop on stage, we could say bye bye to midi patchbays as it could be software driven. This also lends a huge helping hand in being able to control lighting via midi. Wireless and more channels would mean you could program a complet show with all you lighting effects without having to take up a valuable channel on you sequencer or other midi equipment. As it sits, I'm struggling with what I have as my keyboards make changes to my BassPOD and Kurzweil in time live - that's one of my 16 channels gone!!
Yamaha has a way of integrating with certain DAWS and other Yamaha equipment. With a new GM3, maybe we could see a better integration with synths and other equipment. I, like a lot of other synthheads, spend about 60-70% of my time working on my equipment to get everything working right. With more channels, a newer GM and wireless, maybe these work arounds would be become easier and save us musicians some time. Anything - ANYTHING - for more songwriting and performing time!!!
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X-Trade
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Location: Leeds, UK
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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I was thinking of something like an ethernet port, and a switching hub.
you could address your keyboards and modules by IP rather than channel. |
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JonSolo
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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Wireless audio might be a challenge. That would add more delay than is necessary.....too much to stream and too much to encode/decode without expensive dedicated hardware.
On the other hand, wireless MIDI could still be in the 3-15ms range with little problems at all because the basic info is not complex. I totally agree with the IP concept. Printers do it. Xbox does it. Why not keyboards?
GM3 would be a very simple case of determining certain standards:
1. Minimum assigned memory for samples. Given the cost of this being so minimal it should be set around 700mb or the size of a CD minimum.
2. Expand the sound set to force alternate renderings/versions of each sound in the sound set.
3. Expand the requirements to include add-on processing. Many companies add this but make it a PART of the GM3 standard!
4. Incorporate specific control locations for key switched samples so it does not depend on the keyboard itself. AND while you are at it, make some sound options with forced key switching (there are a dozen sounds that would immediately benefit from this being a standard, rather than an option).
This is not a wish for a new keyboard but rather a standard which you know you can work with across a wide selection of modules and increase the quality of General Midi.
Solo
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Windows 10 | Intel i9 9900K | 64 GB RAM | Scarlett 18i20 | Nektar Panorama P6
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Etherium
Joined: 24 Mar 2008
Posts: 36
Location: Somewhere this side of the moon
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| Posted: Sat May 24, 2008 9:09 am Post subject: |
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theres this new controll surface out that got reviewed in th UK futuremusic mag recently....can't think of the name but its something that will give the mackie controll surface a run for its money, though alot more sleek in design with brushed aluminium surface and minimal design. But anyway it uses some type of hi speed ethernet way of transporting relevant controll information, with basically zero latency, not sure if this is what you mean.....?
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JonSolo
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| Posted: Sat May 24, 2008 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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That is the kind of thing that I mean, except apply it to MIDI and make it a standard.
Suggestions for names-
iMIDI (it already has lots of I's but this makes it interconnected)
MIDI2
MIDI-X (as in extreme)
NextMIDI
Super MIDI
The Return of the Son of MIDI, Part Deux
Jon
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RVNOak
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| Posted: Sat May 24, 2008 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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MIDI-AN
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Etherium
Joined: 24 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 6:21 am Post subject: |
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i think if anythings going to happen, there will have to be a period when manufactures will have to support both as a means to not leave people behind with there existing products, i'm no expert but i can't see a new format being significantly better while being backwards compatable with the old format, hence extra connections on the back of new products less space....etc., in many ways this is happening now with firewire and usb. So i spose maybe its just a matter of making an extra firewire or usb port specifically for a standardised format from machine to machine with firmware support, witch is happening i think....?, either way to get the whole industry to jump on board straight away is probably a big change, and oh yeah, nothings gonna work unless its a common format of course....i guess thats the hitch here....like i said I'm no expert so please correct me on my points if needed, but thats my 5 cents worth
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RVNOak
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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This just in!! Read the part about HD-MIDI
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIDI#mLAN
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RVNOak
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Even better!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.midi.org/news/hdmidi.php 
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RVNOak
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zukskywalker
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Joined: 03 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 3:41 am Post subject: |
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So, not an update but while on the subject of wireless midi....
Couldn't I just pop open an old 5.8ghz cordless phone and use just the transmit from the handset to send midi to the base which in turn talks to a midi rig?
5.8ghz for midi? plenty fast.
I know midi's not audio but can't it get on that 5.8ghz somehow?
Midi data rate is 31.25 Kbit/s.
What am I missing here? |
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JonSolo
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 1:46 am Post subject: |
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Ok the wireless MIDI product is ok for now...but rather useless in what I have in mind. I am talking about incorporating wireless as a STANDARD, not an aftermarket product.
In fact the HD-MIDI is on the right track. Most of what is described can already be accomplished in a software host...however, making it standard for all future instruments will be awesome. I do hope they finalize some wireless technology and offer alternative connections as well. The 5 pin MIDI chord is outgrown. By making the connection non-proprietary, currently popular cables are not obsolete and it would be easy to incorporate the parts into hardware.
The most intriguing part of what was posted was the single MIDI message verses compound messages. That will cause an increase in speed and require virtually no bandwidth to run.
Good finds. I had forgotten about HD-MIDI since it has not surfaced in a few years.
Jon
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Jon Solo
http://www.solosounds.net
http://jonsolo.me
http://www.soundcloud.com/jonsolo
http://www.twitter.com/thejonsolo
Windows 10 | Intel i9 9900K | 64 GB RAM | Scarlett 18i20 | Nektar Panorama P6
Korg Kronos - 88 | Korg Kronos 2 - 61 | Roland Fantom 6 | Push 2 | Maschine Mk2 | Slate ML1 | JBL LSR308/310
Nuendo 11 | Ableton Live 11 | Reason 12 | FL Studio 20.9 |
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